A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball

Mendoza Would Fit Right in This Year……..

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on April 21, 2012

As everyone knows, The Mendoza Line is used as the definition of incompetent hitting. Mario Mendoza, a shortstop for 9 years in the major leagues, had a career batting average of .215. Today, the term *The Mendoza Line* refers to a batting average under .200. I bet that somewhere, Big Mario is doing a slow burn about getting cheated out of those precious .15 batting points….

But whatever, if you’re hitting below .200 you are degraded and embarrassed with comments like, “Dude, Crawford is hitting below The Mendoza Line.” Ouch. And it doesn’t really even matter if you’re hitting above .200 because if you’re close to it you get comments like, “My God Crawford is a bad hitter. He’s hitting .205. He’s almost below The Mendoza Line!!! Bahahahahahaha!!!!!!”

The horror…..

As an owner of several (currently under performing) fantasy teams I keep track of pretty much every hitter in baseball. And what I’ve been struck by this season is how many players seem to be hitting under the dreaded Mendoza Line. I hadn’t bothered to confirm if it’s more or less than normal until this morning. And I don’t even know what a *normal* number of Mendoza Line batters is anyway. But even without a frame of reference, this list surprised me:

I had to shrink the page down to 90% just so I could capture the entire list with my trusty *snipping tool*. Take a look at that list. That is some serious collective failure. And most of those guys aren’t within a country mile of the Mendoza Line. They’re all looking up at Brandon Belt (currently hitting .200) and saying, “Man, that dude might be saddled with a fat wife but check out that batting average! Some day, I hope that’s me…”

I decided to see how many Mendoza Line Transgressors there were last season and I couldn’t snip and paste that list into this thread because there was no such list to snip and paste. The lowest batting average in the major leagues last year was Vernon Wells at .218. Of course, they only listed players with a qualified number of at bats. But my first list was also drawn from those who qualified this year.

So then I decided to look at team batting averages. I assumed that no collective TEAM could be batting under .200 so I decided to just look at how many teams are batting under .240 this year. Here they are:

Man, 10 teams? And three of them are batting under Mario’s actual career batting line? What is going on here?

For a point of reference, I checked how this compared to 2011. Two teams batted under .240 for the year: San Diego at .237 and the Mariners at .233. I’m assuming you are all as shocked as I was to not see the Giants on that list……

In 2010, 1 team hit under .240: Again, the hapless Mariners. They were a seaworthy bunch, but they couldn’t hit a lick. 🙂

In 2009, no team hit under .240….

And yet in 2012, there are 10 teams hitting under .240. What gives? I’d love to get to the end of this thread with some plausible theories as to why the hitters are so collectively bad this year but I don’t have any. And that’s where you people come in as I had the baton off to you in 3….2…..1

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  1. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 7:39 am

    So this is how one says that Crawford is actually a fine hitter.

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 7:45 am

      who ever said that?

    • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:38 am

      I haven’t checked out the hitters but last year 11 teams finished April with team averages at .240 or under. Major League team average for 2011 was .251, so far for this year it’s .248. In 2010, the team average for April was .256 with 7 teams hitting .240 or below for the month. In 2009 it was .263 and just three teams under .240. for the month. I only looked since 2000 it’s steadily trended down, that is correct, the April average then was .270. So the only caveat here is one has to compare April to April, not this April to previous full seasons.
      Here’s one article that talks about last year, when offense hit a two decade low:
      http://tinyurl.com/62azcg7
      The most logical explanations are simple- IMO,the pitchers, particalarly middle relief pitchers are better. Tim’s 91 used to be to top of the line, now it’s strictly average. MLB.COM listed the top average 30 fastballs in 2011 ( that’s the pitcher’s average, they can hump it up for more, of course.)
      High was Chapman at 98+, 30th was Price at 94+. Only three were starters. Runzler and Wison were in the top 30, BTW.

  2. dirtnrocksnomo said, on April 21, 2012 at 7:52 am

    Interesting lists there. Undoubtedly some will go straight to the PED program and lack of juiced players but I think that is too simple for the deep thinkers of the Flap.

    Similar to the increase in football players that can’t tackle or basketball players that can’t dribble maybe the fundamental skills of baseball players are getting worse too. You hardly see players with a real quiet stance anymore and their footwork in the box is all over the place. Everyone is trying to jack the bomb instead of putting together good ABs

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 7:58 am

      I like that theory except it doesn’t explain how it got so bad so quickly. Also, the pitchers (who were also taking PED’s) should suffer some kind of regression without their precious steroids, right?

      • dirtnrocksnomo said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:04 am

        I was trying to find the average MLB players age year over year and if it has dramatically dropped the last couple of years but what I found was just this year and it is hard to sort stats on the iPad. I sort numbers all day at work so I tend to give up easily on that stuff when it comes to days off.

        With the increase in size and strength of athletes I would expect pitchers to be more dominant without PEDs since hitting the baseball is so difficult.

  3. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:06 am

    Byrd & Ramirez were 2 guys I’ve wanted for quite awhile. I don’t have any bright ideas about it, but I was particularly struck today by your hard work and commitment to The Flap – and how you are able to come up with these things every day. If I were running the blog I would probably just write: Good morning. GO!

  4. dirtnrocksnomo said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:08 am

    I second DJ’s comment. You’ve been lighting it up all week Flavor. Your in the zone.

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:32 am

      thank you to both of you. The last few days I start typing and have no idea what the thread is going to be about. Usually after a few sentences I find something I want to write about. On the “one for the ages or not?” thread all I was going to write was that I didn’t see the game so i don’t have anything to say about it. Then you guys turned it into one of the best threads of the year…..

  5. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:21 am

    Long night at Citifield. I was way up high above third. Classic torture Giant game. And please don’t tell me no Brian Wilson is no big deal. It’s fuckin’ huge and last night was the first of many times that you’ll realize it. Now WTF was going on at 3rd base? Flannery’s fault? 3 obvious screw-ups – Posey not tagging up – Panda hesitating 3 times before scoring on the WP – sending Melky to a certain death on the grounder. From my angle Blanco’s cutoff in the gap looked amazing. The Mets new CF might be curtains for Andres. Super game from Hector. Seemed like some strange managing, but I lost my scorecard somewhere in the middle of the game. Hensley really came through. I swear the ball was in the catcher’s glove before Bay even started his swing at strike three. Can’t go today. Typhoon tomorrow…

  6. denniszu said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:28 am

    It’s a sad list to be on; but seeing I’m partial to the Giants, I got to throw in the defense contribution that Crawford has displayed. In this young season, it’s unquestionable that he has helped to maintain some of the wins. Personally, if the hitting doesn’t get much better for the team, they will need Crawford’s continued glove to be an added savior on top of pitching for any resulting contention.

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:33 am

      I totally agree with you, as do most *baseball people*

    • DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:37 am

      I like his D, too Dennis. Do we have a choice? Thought he made 2-3 nice plays last night. He also threw a ludicrous rainbow to first on a ball he should’ve held onto in the hole…

      • denniszu said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:49 am

        Rookie reflex action….. that will pass.

  7. willieD said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:29 am

    there are a few NL SS guys on that list, and some others not far ahead of it, including agon at .205, reyes at .214 and lowrie at .222, braves kid at pastornicky at .175. Might be time to see what Burriss can do at SS, and if T is healthy and in the park, let him play 2b. And if you don’t like leadoff guys, I’d throw B in there too. Let pagan hit lower at 6 or 7, with crawford/t 8th. B is currently almost 100 pts. better avg than craw, and can rack up SBs.
    Anyway, I think Henry’s headline is wrong–committee worked. Mota and Affeldt set up and held mets off, til Lopez blew it with a WP, BB and base hit given up, but romo saved his ass from an L, and then Hensley did likewise when R got the ball up and gave up a couple hits. Casilla is still fresh, and I don’t think the others, except for affeldt, threw more than 15 pitches or so.
    Props to Hector, for the tag and the gwrbi. Miller was all over him for grounding out on the first pitch after Pill grounded out and Melk got thrown out at the plate, but the kid responded, big time. It’s good he caught all the pen guys too.

  8. Alleykat said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:30 am

    Just from that list alone Crawford stacks up well.Tied for 2nd in RBI, He’s 1st in doubles, tied for 7th in least amount of K’s with more AB attempts then many as well.Not saying he is a good hitter but he sure is holding his own on this list where their is proven big league talent.

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:35 am

      and he would have had 2 or 3 more RBI’s if that rocket he hit to CF with the bases loaded had fallen in….

  9. paulinasia said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:41 am

    No explanation here, but now that Craig has documented the .200 hitters, it’ll be interesting to see how that changes in the coming weeks as the season goes on. Very possible Crawford doesn’t hit much above that line all season, and while his defense contributes, the other hitters would have to perform at higher levels for his light hitting not to matter as much. Belt, on the other hand, is also around .200, I think, yet I believe he will raise that significantly with more playing time. And what a key play in the 9th — Belt seemed to not handle the hard grounder cleanly at first, but recovered and made that strong throw, with a good catch and tag by Sanchez to keep it tied. Nice play to watch on the replays for us who can’t see the game. Sanchez making his presence felt too. Good all around.

  10. willieD said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:41 am

    I just started “summer of ’68″….hope this isn’t another great year of the pitcher like that one was, when Yaz led the league in hitting, at .301.
    If i’m not mistaken, Hector tried to deke somebody by slapping his mitt on the ground twice (might have been Thole AB vs. Lopez) and then standing up while the P threw a high hard one.
    Funny thing is, on the A’s game they had Fingers in the booth (they are celebrating 72 W vs. Reds) and they replayed the fake intentional BB vs. Bench/called strike 3 play. Fingers said williams came to the mound and started pointing all over everywhere, which was a total deke. He told the C to hold his arm out and then get back into re stance once Fingers lifted his leg in the windup, and Fingers was ordered to throw bench a slider. F also said joe morgan yelled at bench from 3b , “they’re going to pitch to you.”

  11. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:44 am

    Crawford stacks up well against other shitty hitters, that’s a good one…
    See my post above-you compare Aprils to Aprils. Not this April to prior full seasons.

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:46 am

      that 8:38am post is a sound contribution to the blog. Well done!

      • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 9:03 am

        Uh, thanks, I think. A few relevant and interesting facts never hurt any discussion.

      • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 9:05 am

        I was serious. That is a perfectly plausible theory that I hadn’t even thought of

    • willieD said, on April 21, 2012 at 9:00 am

      he doesn’t stack up well at all; my point was there are bunch of other guys at SS in the league that suck too, kind of like backup C last year. LA thought highly of Gordon, but he’s not hitting either. Maybe all the errors are in C head; maybe he could use a trip back to Fresno to get his game together, if he can. I’m fine with burriss or even arias in there at SS, but not Theriot.

  12. Alleykat said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:55 am

    SS and Catcher are the most demanding position’s on the field.They have taken care of the Catcher situation. with Sanchez, so if they want to help out Crawford some, just bring up Arias to platoon some and dump Theriot.

  13. denniszu said, on April 21, 2012 at 8:57 am

    Let me dream a little here and imagine the SS/2B chemistry that will result when Freddie comes back. If his should is fine and we know his hitting will probably not be a problem, that will be the linchpins to shore up some contention movement…. maybe 2 weeks?

    • blade3colorado said, on April 21, 2012 at 9:42 am

      I hope “Glass” finds his way back denniszu, but in my opinion, he is history. As I said a few days ago, he may make it back, but he’ll find his way back to the DL within 2-4 weeks of returning to the line-up. Shoulder injuries are different for everyone. My personal theory – based upon my own experience and what I have been told by physicians and personal trainers – is that a pitcher probably has a better chance of returning if only because they do “repetitive” motions (i.e., pitching) which the shoulder can adjust to. Conversely, Freddy at 2nd, will have to make all sorts of throws at different angles, with explosive movements Couple that with diving and being taken out by runners at 2nd base, well, it’s going to be a lot harder for him to return.

      I mentioned my own personal experience . . . I fell off a mountain and tore two rotator tendons. I lift weights regularly/am in very good shape and am able to do just about everything I once did prior to my injury. However, something as innocuous as reaching for something or lifting a coffee cup will send a slight twinge w/minor to extreme pain to my shoulder. It doesn’t always happen, but sometimes it does. Weird. Basically, I avoid Plyometrics (which exploit the stretch-shortening cycle of muscles to enhance the myotatic (stretch) reflex) type exercises due to the increased risk of injury. However, Freddy is probably concentrating on these types of exercises because baseball is all about “quick reaction” explosive motions.

      In any event, I give him less that a 25% chance of coming back.

      • denniszu said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:11 am

        Blade, I don’t doubt you logic on low probability; and maybe I’m a little to ‘high’ on Freddie. Your hits on the rigors of a 2B’man’s dives makes me cringe as it is Freddie’s all out efforts that I would worry about…
        But I’ll hang on that 25% as I’m sure the Team is as well and hope that he uses his seasoned experiences and finds alternatives to find ways to avoid the dives… sounds crazy but I’m sticking to it…..
        Besides the fielding, we could use his bat.

  14. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 9:23 am

    I haven’t checked every guy on the sub-.200 list, but enough of them to see that nearly all are simply off to slow starts. Unlike most, Crawford has no history to suggest he can be counted on to raise that average above .200. And he will not be the starting shortstop if he can’t do that . Craig stated that I don’t “like” Crawford, if he meant that I don’t like him as a hitter, that would be correct. And he has no track record or current production that would cause anyone to like him as a hitter. We’ve gotten nothing but “if he can hit (fill in the number, it ranges anywhere from .200 to .250). My guess is that they’d take .230. They won’t take .190, dreamers.They have a good fielding player destroying AAA who also has a .276 MLB average with OBP and OPS well above Crawford’s. I completely support giving Brandon more time, June 1 is enough. If he can’t hit by then, forget him. Right now, Arias is a HUGE upgrade.

  15. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 9:33 am

    Obviously the balls have been UN-juiced.
    but, seriously, it is April, Baltimore leads the east and the Dogers are playing .800 ball. That should say all we need about small sample size. and the known changes coming as the season moves on. Perhaps hitters are going through what pitchers did during expansion days – not enough talent to go around.

    • Bozo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:02 am

      Ed – I’ve got to tell you, You Are The Man. We have quite a few East Coasters watching the games but watching a game at 4 in the morning, man oh man. One of these days I want to do a dial-a-shot with you across the Pond. Hell, maybe we can hook in West coast, East coast and bloody England.

      And a happy World Circus Day to all us clowns (that includes all Flappers and Flapettes)..

  16. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 9:37 am

    One short-term benefit of Hector, if he’s as good as he looks, is that they can DH Posey a lot during that 9 game inter-league road trip in June…

  17. blade3colorado said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:02 am

    “And please don’t tell me no Brian Wilson is no big deal. It’s fuckin’ huge and last night was the first of many times that you’ll realize it.”

    I agree this will potentially haunt us. Conga line closer committee will eventually have to shake out and IMO, Casilla will end up on top. No idea if he is up to the job. The 3 lefties Lopez faced was once in a blue moon thing, but I hate his sidearm pitching motion and were lucky that it didn’t turn out worse than what happened last night.

    • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:34 am

      Sorry, but I don’t see that one night proves anything. It was one of the few times that Bochy’s pen management might be questioned, however. The quick hook of Casilla seemed unwarranted. We have more than last night to judge this on, however. Wilson was out between Aug 15 and Sept 18 last year. During that time period, Casilla was 5 for 5 in saves ( he picked another after Wilson returned) and Ramirez was 2 for 2. There were no blown saves.

      • DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:13 am

        I didn’t say it “proved” it, and there’s no guarantee that BW wouldn’t have blown it as well. I just think last night was the first of many times when we’ll miss our stud closer. And there’s big difference between last years 5 week sample and this year’s full season…

      • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:02 pm

        We’ll see. I’ve provided studies that conclusively prove that leads are no safer with a single closer than they were for decades when it had always been “closer by committee”.
        I’ll miss this, though. One of the better water cooler destructions:

  18. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:06 am

    In what was obviously total coincidence, Hector hit 3 home runs the day after I made him my prospect of the day last year. That got the attention of a lot of folks…
    Of our current farm crop, most disappointing is Gary Brown, hitting .207 with 1 SB in AA. Joseph has started to pick it up a bit. at .250 now but just 1 HR. Dominguez is hitting .383, but again with little power. Tommy is still a kid, he’ll get his HRs, but Dominguez needs to find that stroke and NOW. His average will go way down, he needs to be a

    a minimum 25 HR guy down there to have any shot. As AA prospects go, he’s getting long in the tooth. In Fresno, Kieschnick is tearing it up, as is Arias, and even Nick Noonan. We all know by now to be wary of PCL numbers, but those three and Culberson definitely bear watching. As does Eric Hacker who was pitching lights out in 2010, then fell off the end of the Earth ( supposedly the front office considered him instead of MadBum to bring up). He’s back and pitching well again. Hembree has pitched 5 innings 4 H 1 R 2 BB 4 K. Travis Blackley has been lights out and Kown has pitched well. Relievers Edlefsen and Kontos have also shown well.

    • DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:10 am

      The greatest Brown ever was Jim Brown. Ollie second. Chris third.

      • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:51 am

        And Jim was a mighty fine woman beater, too.

    • eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:11 am

      I remember your reporting on Hector last year and again at ST. After watching him for a full game last night I can see why. He is No Whitey. at all

  19. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:13 am

    No lineup today? It must be worse than usual if no one wanted to post it.

    • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:37 am

      You made that YOUR job, Menace.
      1.Pagan CF
      2.Cabrera LF
      3.Sandoval 3B
      4.Posey C
      5.Huff 1B
      6.Schierholtz RF
      7.Burriss 2B
      8.Crawford SS
      9.Vogelsong P

  20. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 10:16 am

    All those empty seats behind the plate start at $400 a pop. If they can’t sell ’em to corporations, who the fuck do they expect to buy ’em? Yankee Stadium is even worse…

  21. Nipper said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:00 am

    I guess they’ll have to lower the mound. I will not pay a dime to see this current lineup.

    • Bozo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:03 am

      Mets or Giants?

  22. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:10 am

    I’m sure glad Huff began the year in shape. Go back to the cigarettes, Budweiser and thong.
    The Jack LaLanne approach isn’t working either.

    • eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:16 am

      I thought about conditioning watching Barry last night, who supposedly had some extra off season conditioning. He will need strength and endurance to keep pitching like he has been as the season moves on.

      • Bozo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:19 am

        Ed, I don’t know if you saw my comment above – but your watching a game at 4 in the morning really impressed me.

  23. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:18 am

    Vogue! Vogue! Vogue!

  24. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:19 am

    and my view was coloured by personal experience, but my hat was tipped for Bruce last night. If you can juggle 24 players on and off the field in 10 innings and make it look as easy as he did last night . . .

  25. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:19 am

    Vogey is looking tough. I had him pegged for a “bounce” year. I woulda been happy with anything close to last year. But he looks like he’s picked up right where he left off. Now with Zito finding his box of Lucky Charms, if we could only get that slacker Timmy to pull his weight we might be on to something.

  26. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:22 am

    Craw now 0 fer his last 15. But he sure does have a full head of hair.

    • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:35 am

      You’re being unfair. He’s had some good at bats. He deserves to be THREE for 15…

      • Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:47 am

        That would give Craw a .200 avg in his last 15 ABs. He doesn’t deserve that much.

  27. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:29 am

    You guys warming up to Pagan?

  28. ewisco said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:30 am

    csnba is showing shots of giants fans in the stands. how do we tell if we’re looking at flappers? we need a gang sign.

  29. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:30 am

    Vogelsong was/is the key to the rotation and I thought so even before Linecum’s troubles. We know that Zito will revert to form, at least us baseball people do…if Vogelsong is even close to last year, we’ll have a solid starting group once Tim rights himself. If Ryan doesn’t come through, we have a Big 3 and zero 4/5. 4 solid starters wins the division regardless of what Zit does, just 3 means third place…

  30. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:33 am

    Met announcer said the Giants have reached out to Tim & Posey regarding long term deals after signing Bumgarner. I didn’t know that…

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:38 am

      I think they discussed some things with Timmy and that discussion ended when his agent said *8 years*. I haven’t heard a thing about Posey.

  31. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:37 am

    I don’t have a good feeling about Huff this inning…

    • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 3:39 pm

      Spot on, Loo. You do it again.

  32. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:44 am

    Latest Face of the Franchise standings:

    1. Posey: Holds on to his lead with a good start and a solid sympathy vote
    2. Panda : Strong move with excellent April and winning personality
    3. Cain : Solid citizen type always garners the senior vote
    4. MadBum: Snot Rocketeering costs votes from Miss Manners devotees
    5. Lincecum: Precipitous fall due to poor performance and blame shifting

  33. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:45 am

    Just how long is Huff’s noose, I mean leash again?

    • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:47 am

      I think it’s been shortened quite a bit. He might go before Belt OR Pill now.
      huff

      • Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:54 am

        Before Pill? I dunno. Unlike Brett, when they stick Daddy in LF at least I don’t close my eyes.
        And Bochy needs to stop that NOW. If he’s going to be making defensive replacements in the 5th inning, then he shouldn’t be starting him in left in the first place.

  34. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:50 am

    Good observation by Darling: “Every one of Vogelsong’s pitches has a purpose”

    Can someone delete my 11:37 AM comment?

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:15 pm

      I fixed it for you my man.

  35. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:53 am

    Yeah, Clown, thanks, the Giants are my team and it was a Friday night with not much planned for Saturday. And now ESPN has the game on, it’s only 8pm and it is the Comcast feed.
    WOO HOO!
    And I definitely up for a coast to coast to country phone/video hookup sometime. well, anytime actually 🙂

  36. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:56 am

    Can we all take a moment to mourn for Rick Porcello; FLAVs Detroit starter to day who got killed by Texas in the first inning today. ERA = 72.0 WHIP = 11.0
    ouch

  37. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 11:58 am

    I can see it now: Bochy will announce Belt starting tomorrow knowing full well the game will get rained out.

    • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:22 pm

      that should work out well for him by saving him from having to add 3 or 4 more K’s on to his stat sheet….

  38. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:03 pm

    I’m gonna say if we didn’t have this “Closer by Committee” and Bochy had to use ’em all last night, he woulda PH for Vogey there. Another case in point when we miss Wilson.

    • zumie said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:15 pm

      Yes- Wilson got injured and is out for the season. Are you going to accept that at some point and stop whining about it?

      • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:21 pm

        Agreed. Dennis do you just always have to have at least ONE thing to bitch about constantly? He’s fucking gone for the season, stop thinking about it.

      • Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:24 pm

        I accepted it from the get-go. I’m just reminding those who said we wouldn’t really miss him. They’re the ones who need to accept it.

      • zumie said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:52 pm

        WE MISS HIM. There, I said it. The difference is that the rest of us have moved on from it.

  39. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:10 pm

    Pure conjecture, Bochy has used that many pitchers countless times. And some who were used were still available today.

    • zumie said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:18 pm

      Plus, the Giants had the day off on Thursday. There’s no excuse for Bochy not pinch-hitting for Vogelsong. It was an inexplicable move by Bochy. I was driving, and heard Fleming sound as critical as he’s willing to sound about Bochy on that move, or “non-move”, actually.
      And naturally, the baseball gods must punish that by having Vogelsong struggle the next inning.

  40. snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:18 pm

    HIghly dubious serious of moves by Bochy re: Vogelsong. And, I would have loaded ’em to make them PH for Pelfrey to get him out of there and set up the Dplay. Meanwhile, where is the running? Pagan gets on, doesn’t even attempt to steal in a tight game. Bochy’s puckered up some of the running we saw in ST…

  41. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:18 pm

    EDD_— Yes, I started Porcello today. I own him on all 5 of my teams. On the drive home I heard about the carnage he left after the first inning. I couldn’t be certain (because in 3 of those leagues I set my LU once a week on Mondays and I couldn’t remember about my other espn league) but I THOUGHT I had only started him in the Flap league. I got home, raced to my computer to see……a exhaled a huge sigh of relief. He’s on my bench in all four of my other leagues. Now, that didn’t diminish my disappointment with having started him on my Flap team but it eased the pain significantly. It’s gonna take me 3 weeks to fix that fuck up by Porcello in the Flap League…..

  42. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:20 pm

    Huff. Wow.

  43. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:20 pm

    Now Huff’s taking his ABs out into the field with him. Put ’em out of his misery.

  44. snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:21 pm

    Sheezus.
    Huff is making a trade or getting cut a little easier every time he gets near the ball, on offense or defense. He better get it together the next two weeks or something has to be done with him…

  45. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:21 pm

    squibbler in front of home
    posey grabs it
    to second for one, on to first

  46. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:22 pm

    or not

  47. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    That wasn’t on Crawford, Lopez SHOULD have had that…..

  48. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:27 pm

    Hey, I’d be totally fine with Huff getting released yesterday— he plays shitty defense and he’s showing that last year’s hitting misery is going to continue into this year.
    It might even get Belt some of the starts you all seem to think he so richly deserves. *might*
    I don’t think I can recall a catcher doing what Posey just did…….

    • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:34 pm

      Belt should never have been taken out of the line up.

      • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:45 pm

        Brian Sabean and Bochy disagree with you. But hey, they aren’t baseball people, right?

  49. snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:27 pm

    A good defensive play, no TWO good defensive plays in a row. Both from Posey. Shocking.
    Bochy has to start chewing some ass on this horrific defense, if he hasn’t already…

  50. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:28 pm

    4pitches, 3outs
    bookit

  51. manny said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:29 pm

    I have been lurking here for a long time, enjoying watching you guys. Huff’s play has finally made me have to chime in here. The guy has dynamited our chances to win this game with his play in the field. Even the Mets announcers have been commenting on how bad his play is in the field. It’s not like the guy is doing anything with the bat.

    • snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:38 pm

      Hey dude, welcome.
      You off that woman’s hormone shit yet?… 🙂

  52. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:30 pm

    Huff is now 1 for 16 and NOT getting good at bats…
    As to not hitting for Vogey, it was a TIE game, he was pitching well, and he’s a good hitter. No controversy at all, especially with 2 out.

    • zumie said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:55 pm

      Fleming disagrees, but he’s not a baseball guy.

  53. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:31 pm

    Dennis—because Bochy used a bunch of relievers last night had no bearing on why he didn’t PH for Voggy today (I don’t think). The bullpen came into this game completely fresh and none of them threw that many pitches yesterday. Plus, tomorrow’s game is likely getting rained out. Bochy knows this. He just fucked up and made the wrong call. It happens…..
    If anything, Bochy fucked up last night by only letting Casilla pitch to one hitter. Casilla is not a specialist, he can get anyone out with his stuff….

    • Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:37 pm

      Bochy said on his on his pregame show on KNBR that not all of the guys from last night were available today. Whether that was the reason he didn’t PH for Vogey, we may never know. But I’m saying it couldn’t of helped.

      • twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:40 pm

        Pinch hitting for Vogelsong was not a consideration, and shouldn’t have been. I’ve provided the reasons.

      • Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:42 pm

        at most, Affeldt was the one who wasn’t available. He pitched 2 innings, 32 pitches. But that’s it. EVERYONE was completely well rested coming into last night’s game. So maybe he was talking about Affeldt and Zito cause all the rest of the guys were good to go today…..

      • Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:46 pm

        Bull fucking shit. Go ahead run on second in the 7th is a PHing scenario. As Z pointed out, it wasn’t well received on the radio. But since you say it shouldn’t have been considered that makes it right. Go grab a shovel a clean up your own bullshit.

      • zumie said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:59 pm

        I listened to the entire Bochy show today and don’t remember him talking about who was available. That’s just me sayin.’ I could be wrong.

  54. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:31 pm

    tying run on deck

  55. snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:33 pm

    I think the real calculus on Huff is Hector. Can he continue to hit, or will the league catch up to him? I’d be totally fine with cutting/trading Huff for a sack of marbles immediately, or when they get back home. That starts to free up the logjam at first. Posey should be playing more 1B so we can get Hector more starts. We need Hector’s bat in the lineup more than every Zito sighting. The kid can flat hit, and this team needs more of that. Huff — another chopper. The dude looks done and in need of a smoke…

  56. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:37 pm

    Burriss is really impressing me this year…..

    • snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:47 pm

      Unbelievable…

      • snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:48 pm

        I meant that one on Belt’s dropped pop!

  57. DJLoo said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  58. Bozo said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    Hell yeah

  59. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    It’ll look like a line drive double in the box score. Oops!

  60. manny said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:48 pm

    How about that Brandon Belt.

  61. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:48 pm

    Are you fucking kidding me???!?!?!?!!?!?!?

  62. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:48 pm

    Now THAT’S what I call a clutch pop fly 😉

  63. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:49 pm

    can’t wait to see this infield alignment in the next inning

  64. snarkk said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:50 pm

    Shades of the ‘Stick.
    I ask you, that was one tough AB that Belt handled. He should have made out, but he has a good eye, and took ball 3 on a very close pitch. Put that AB against the typical ABs we’ve seen the last coupled hundred ABs from Huff. No comparison…

  65. Del Mar Dennis said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:50 pm

    Who going to play SS in the bottom half?

  66. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:50 pm

    did we hear anything about where in the stadium is Pawlie?

  67. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:51 pm

    no, he texted me this morning tho that he was on his way.

  68. eddacker said, on April 21, 2012 at 12:57 pm

    praying for rain tomorrow?

  69. twinfan1 said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:00 pm

    Whatever happens here, try to remember that Wilson wasn’t used in tie games on the road.

  70. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:01 pm

    Pawlie says he’s in section 513 behind the plate

  71. Bozo said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:02 pm

    I’m not sure if I want to see Huff trying to turn a DP or I do.

    • Bozo said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:12 pm

      Well that answered that.

  72. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:03 pm

    Dennis, with Affeldt, Lopez and Hensley all now pitching in this game I’m having trouble seeing who was *off limits* today according to what you think you heard on the Bochy show. Casilla? He threw 1 pitch last night. Romo? he threw 4. I think you misheard Bochy today…..

  73. zumie said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:05 pm

    The most hilarious thing about that pop-up is that the centerfielder actually ended up OVER-running the ball.

  74. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:05 pm

    Brutal.

  75. Flavor said, on April 21, 2012 at 1:06 pm

    How could he not be ready to go to 2nd to field that throw? That’s just simple and obvious and has nothing to do with not playing 2nd before………


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