THE San Francisco Giants Blog

If the Crazy Horse Rides off Into the Insane Sunset….

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on November 17, 2012

I feel pretty good about the chances of Pagan coming back to SF. Sabean has to be fairly certain about it otherwise he would have bothered to send him a qualifying offer to at least get the draft pick if he went elsewhere. Maybe he thought that type of offer would insult Angel, I don’t know. But all it did was make Pagan MORE appealing to other clubs who need a starting center fielder. I better stop thinking about this, the more I type the more it looks like he’s signing elsewhere……

Let’s say that he signs with The Reds. Now we slide Blanco to CF with Pence still in RF and Sabean will be forced to make a free agent move unless he wants to give Brown a shot at CF and keep Blanco in LF—-now you’ve got 2/3 of your outfield represented by different sized question marks…..

Who’s out there that would be realistic to see Sabean signing if Pagan leaves and Brown stays in the minors?

I’m crossing  Bourn and Upton off the list because that’s just not how B-Sabes rolls anymore.

So I’m gonna start in *Room B* and go from there:

Shane Victorino:  He’s 31 but he’s an *old* 31 and if last year was any indication, his career is starting to slide. Assuming it was a 1-2 year deal, I’d grade this signing as a C-

Juan Pierre: He’s 35 and could probably be had on a 1 year deal. Everyone talks about his girlish arm but he’s a .297 hitter career hitter and had a very nice year last season in Philly. I think he’d do a very nice job at the top of our LU as a stopgap till Brown was ready. I’d grade this signing as a B-

Rick Ankiel: …sucks. This signing would get graded as an F

Jonny Gomes: Love this guy— he’s a blue collar, hard working, genuine player. He’s not that good of a baseball player, but he’s a hell of a guy who would be a great clubhouse presence. I could see him hitting .240 or so with 15-16 bombs. Maybe a little more. I’d grade out a 1-2 year deal for him as a B

Scott Hairston: I was surprised to see he’s only hit .248 against us. It feels like .448. Or maybe that’s one of the *other* Hairston’s. Either way, he’s probably a little more talented version of Gomes. I’d grade this a B, too.

Ryan Ludwick— Didn’t Romo battle him through like a 9 minute at bat in the NLCS? I think that was Ludwick. This guy is gonna cost more than any of the other guys listed above— I could see him getting a 2 year/20 million dollar deal, something like that. And because of that I’d grade this signing as a C but of all the guys listed so far, he would be the best alternative for us.

Cody Ross— it’s deja vu all over again for the former rodeo clown. He’s looking for 3 years and no one seems interested. I’d take him back on a 1-year deal but he’ll probably get at least 2 from someone. If the price was 2 years/16 million I’d wince a little but be generally positive about him coming back. Grade: B-

Nate McClouth: He had quite the resurgent year in Baltimore. He’s 31. probably taking steroids, and is looking for a 2-3 year deal. This guy is as likely to hit .140 as he is to hit 20 bombs for us. He’s a lefty with speed and a little power though and that combo goes a loooong way in triples alley. On a 2 year deal, I’d grade this as a C+ and just hope for the best…….

Ichiro: Ah, Konichiwa Ichiro! What would a deal for Ichiro look like? Let’s just say a year at 15 million and then he heads home in 2014 with his buddy Kuroda for a swan song season in Japan. I think Ichiro has enough left in the tank to squeeze out a productive season in SF. He too would see lots of balls rolling a long, long way into triples alley. I’d grade this as a B+

So that’s it. 9 options, all underwhelming in their own way. But the price is right for most of them. If you sign any of these guys to a short term deal you give yourself some options mid-season if Brown is tearing up triple A. Bring him up if the free agent is sucking, keep him down there if the free agent is performing as expected. Either way, I’d really like to see Brown get another season of minor league ball under his Belt.

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  1. willedav said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:40 am

    Depressing post. Some of the above might have been OK a few years ago; I was up on Ludwick til he sucked his way out of STL, then sucked worse for the Pads. He’d have to hit 25-30 bombs to make up for his lack of D And I’m sure he’d love going to back to Petco again, lol.
    Vic could still possibly lead off and play decent D. Pierre Gomes Hairston MacL, no. Dunno what you expect to get out of Ichiro, but it ain’t gonna be $15 mil worth. altho, if you are up for giving a guy like Pence $13 mil for his .743 OPS last year when he spent most of it in Philly bandbox, then yeah it makes sense.
    Ross we could have had on a multi year deal before he left–it would cost more now, and for what? Great guy, just your avg. run of the mill OF who might have a tougher time in CF here. And might not hit a lot better than blanco and his .675 OPS if left out there every day.
    Brown….no one knows til he gets here what he can do. He might be a real spark, or he might be like other top rated prospects and struggle mightily. Jemile Weeks? Justin smoak? Jason Heyward of 2011? How long did it take that Carter 1b of the A’s to finally crack their less than awesome LU?
    so you have multiple options of suckitude if he signs elsewhere, hopefully balanced by Pagan’s good feelings from a year here. Bets?

  2. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:41 am

    First, I don’t think Blanco is a given. I hope they resign him because I really like the guy. It seemed to me that the League figured him out and it took him a long time to adjust, but in the end he did.
    Ludwick is proof that Panda could play LF if the Giants wanted him to play there, hell he’s proof that JT Snow could have played LF. Ichiro will not be in CF for any team. Of the guys you mentioned I like Ross the best because he can play all three OF positions, all though I think he is also more suited to a corner position. So to me Pagan, Blanco or Brown are our best options unless Sabes puts his trading cap on. Trade for Stanton put him in RF, Pence in LF and a little ST competition between Brown and Blanco for who plays CF.

  3. eddacker said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:36 am

    Blanco we all like, I do not think Brown will work, Bourn maybe and I am all in on Hamilton. With one divot – I have never met the man. Just ‘bringing’ a player on board does not a good team member make.
    In today’s world I would think players would not worry about press or loyalty or where they are. Just play the game and cash the check. But then I never thought people would pay for water.
    Considering the downside to many of the previous nine, if Hamilton has the backing of Sabes/Bruce and the wish to play here; bring it on.

  4. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:59 am

    First, Blanco doesn’t have tio be signed, Bozo. He’s not even arb eligible until next year, he’s ours. Gomes? The grade’s a mite high for .240, mid-teens HRs, no defense. Best choices by far are Ludwick and Ross, IMO.
    But the best choice if Pagan leaves was given months ago- Posey in LF, Blanco or Brown CF, Pence RF. If they’re uncertain about Hector, there’s a good crop of FA catchers as insurance.Hey, maybe our trainer needs a swift knee to the groin..

    • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:27 am

      OK I’m confused. I thought we signed him to a one year deal and 2012 was his first year being arbitration eligible. But you’re right, we do control him by offering arb or a deal he excepts before arb.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:55 am

        I’m just going according to Baseball Reference. They indicate his first arb year is 2013 and he will not be a FA until 2017. So, I dunno.

      • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:08 am

        I think you are right, John. Here is the listing from Cots…

        http://tinyurl.com/aaogeu5

        Either way…he’ll be back…

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:06 am

      Actually (and this according to Cots), he will be in his second year of AE next year. Made $560K this year. I think he is back…and is good value at whatever the cost either as a starter (I hope not) or the 4th OFer, pinch-runner, etc.

  5. blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:02 am

    Yeah, I agree with Willie – A depressing post (but nonetheless, well-written Flav 🙂 ).

    OK, you guys know I have been in Crazy Horse’s camp from the get go and thought the Sabester unequivocally fucked the Mets management in the ass and stole their milk and ding dongs too.

    So, from the flotsam available in Flav’s post, I select Ichiro – if only because he has a pedigree that the other “death row” dogs don’t have. In short, they remain in the dog pound so to speak, until some other team saves them from lethal injection.

    Regarding Brown, he is too raw and it would be a near miracle to see him join the team in September, much less secure a roster spot out of spring training. Unless I missed the memo, the Giants are a “reload” team, not a “rebuild” team.

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:09 am

      Me too (been in CH’s camp)…love the “thought the Sabester unequivocally fucked the Mets management in the ass and stole their milk and ding dongs too.” LMMFAO on that one!!!

  6. Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:10 am

    and I know I wasn’t clear, but if it was Ichiro I’d obviously have him play in RF and move Pence to LF with Blanco in CF. 15 mil isn’t that much for a guy on a one year deal. It’d be like a *Randy Johnson* deal. I think we paid him 9 but Ichiro, in theory, would play in 65-70% more games than Johnson was supposed to play in.

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:12 am

      I voted for Ichiro in the poll…and out of those listed, think he is the best option…especially playing 81 games in our yard…

  7. Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:11 am

    and I agree with Twin, my grades for Gomes/Ludwick and a few others are too high. I probably gave Victorino too high of a grade and I did him first and based the others off that grade……

  8. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:33 am

    After reading the Posey in LF controversy, I did some elementary school math comparing Burrell in 2010 to Blanco last year. Basically, over 30 nine inning games, Burrell would have about 5 fewer putouts than Blanco. Assuming those missed POs are hits with the slow LFer, I don’t see the odds of the W-L record over those 30 games being negatively affected as that great.

    I finally read the Nate Silver piece. What’s interesting about that controversy is that Cabrera has great old fashioned SABR numbers. He is not “overrated” like an Andre Dawson or Joe Carter were, 2 of the classic targets for the geeks. I suggested that the triple crown was an arbitrary measure of excellence. By that I obviously didn’t mean it said nothing about the quality of the player’s season. It would be pretty difficult to win the TC and fail to have a pretty good OBP and SP. The analogy to hitting for the cycle isn’t perfect, but if you hear that “Gomez went 4 for 5 with 4 extra base hits, including a home run,” it just isn’t going to grab your attention the same way. Of course, the argument for Trout is even more obscure than that, what with those fancy fielding stats.

    All of which is to say, sign Jonny Gomes! Not only does he come with that awesome UZR, he would also bring us closer to having a real Gomez on the roster.

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:50 am

      I refuse to think about signing anyone whose first and last names both fail spell check. Johnny Gomez I’m down with.

      • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:14 am

        lqtm…

  9. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:45 am

    Updating some Winter and Fall numbers:

    Brown .314 BA .357 OBP .732 OPS 2-5 SB (AFL)
    Adrianza .269 BA .383 OBP .768 OPS (VWL)
    Chris Dominguez .317 BA .364 OBP .949 OPS 3 HR (AFL)
    Kieschnick .239 BA .313 BA .722 OPS 4 HR (DWL)
    Panik .205 BA .295 OBP .565 OPS 4-4 SB (AFL)

    Note: Villalona back in action- 11 AB, 3 H, 1 HR (DWL)

    Here’s the link if you want to check out the pitchers, too. Hembree looking pretty good.

    http://mlb.mlb.com/milb/stats/org.jsp?id=sf

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:17 am

      Thanks, Twin. Dominguez is a bit of a surprise…combined last year between Richmond and Fresneck:

      .235, .259, .331, .590

  10. Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:02 am

    Actually, Angel showed up last Summer and played in the Dominican Summer League. Now he’s in the Dominican Winter League. I heard he was just hitting as a DH/PH but maybe something’s changed since then………

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:10 am

      I hadn’t seen that. Surprised there wasn’t more pub on it.
      155 AB .303 BA .430 OBP .927 OPS 7 HR 34 RBI
      Don’t know what position he’s playing this winter, he’s listed as 1B

      • James said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:53 am

        The 430 OBP to go with the HRs makes you take notice. Do that over 600 PAs, and my loyalty to the Baby Giraffe might suffer a bit.

      • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:21 am

        Well, Angel did this in the Dominican league…no guarantee those numbers translate to MLB, or even the minors.

        His last in our minor system was in San Jose:

        .267, .306, .397, .704

        That was a partial season. Prior to that in Low A Augusta his numbers were comparible to SJ…

    • snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:50 pm

      I still contend the only way Villalona ever sees ATT Park as an active MLB player is in another team’s uni…

  11. ewisco said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:10 am

    I went with Gomes because i liked how he came across in the A’s dugout. I’m under the impression, based on absolutely no data, that he’s a decent defender. If that’s wrong then fuck him, sign someone else. I’m less worried about the power numbers than defense and character. I would also be wary of overspending for Pagan. nothing over 3 years. Brown should certainly get a legitimate shot in ST, though i doubt he’s ready to take advantage of it. I wouldn’t be locked into playing him in center though.

    when do pitchers and catchers report? I remember in 2010 Flavor had a countdown which seemed to make things go faster. I seem to have lost interest in football, though it’s on as background noise. I did catch a little of the W’s game last night, an unusual occurance for me. the floor was pretty ugly but has nothing on the oregon floor. I’m intrigued by the W’s this year, probably the first time since Bill King, who should be in Hall of fame, was announcing games.

    a damp and drizzly saturday. i’ll probably spend the day straightening either the office or the garage. joy.

    • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:25 am

      a countdown? I’ll work on it.

    • James said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:42 am

      I measured the characters, and Ichiro had the highest with a total of 15.

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:22 am

      That (3 years) is what I would LIKE to see, but I think it will take 4 years to sign Crazy Horse, and for say, 4 at 36 or so, I’m down with that. But four is the limit…

  12. blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:24 am

    Unrelated to Giants . . . JBat, hang in there regarding your divorce. A couple of things – now quite hilarious to me – which ate my lunch at the time of my 2000 divorce process: 1. My decision to follow my attorney’s “good will” advice and pay my wife’s attorney fees; 2. My decision to not give my wife any part of my retirement ; 3. My decision to keep the house; and, 4. Loss of weight.

    Regarding number 1, big, big mistake. Despite me telling my future ex to contact me first vs. her attorney regarding any questions she might have with regard to the divorce, she decided to ignore that advice . . . Of course, her attorney would immediately turn the “hour glass” upside down the minute any of her clients contacted her. My future ex finally got smart and did contact me after I showed her the first monthly bill with her dozens of phone calls. Grrrrrrr . . .

    Regarding number 2, when you work for the Feds, ex spouses can’t get any of your pension until you retire, unlike the private sector. So, I told my ex that she probably wouldn’t see any of my pension any time soon. I also told her that a coworker would probably find my skeleton carcass inside my office, before I would retire. That coupled with the fact, I told her attorney that the stress of the divorce, necessitated me going to the Caribbean for a vacation, and also taking an extended trip to my parents house in California. In short, I was going to pull about $15k out of a mutual fund, unless the ex settled quick, sans having any part of my pension. The next day my ex settled.

    Regarding number 3 and 4, I didn’t want additional chaos selling a house, so I decided to keep the house and buy out my future ex via my private stock holdings. However, I didn’t have sufficient private funds to buy her out, plus I didn’t want to touch my government related investments, nor my pension to do so. In short, I turned into a day trader vs. the prudent investor I had always been. That initially turned ugly really fast . . . I recall losing $10k to 20k in a few minutes, then an hour later, either losing another $20k or gaining back $10k. Co-workers noticed that I started smoking again and would go outside to have 2-3 cigarettes, attempting to figure out what to do. I also lost over 20 lbs. In short, I was a nervous wreck. For approx. a month this went on . . . Fast forward to a Friday at the end of February 2000 (it might have been March), I finally made all the money I owed her and sold everything. I think I had about 23 cents above the settlement figure we agreed upon. I transferred everything into my credit union money market account and contacted the future ex and nonchalantly asked her where I should forward the money? Oh, one last thing – the following week, the “Dot Com” collapse occurred and the stock market sunk. If I had been holding those stocks (Applied Materials, Intel, Novell, Microsoft, Cisco, etc.) I had sold the week before, I would probably of ended up with 20 cents on the dollar. Yes, I thanked the Lord after that occurred. 🙂

    For all that, my friends and family said I did relatively well. Ha. If they only knew. The ex and I are friends today, but divorce is hard regardless of your situation (made much more so if children are involved, which fortunately we did not have). Again, good luck JBat . . . You’ll find out that being single is a blast. At least it is for me.

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:27 am

      I too wish you good luck, JBat. Went through mine about 10 years ago. Am lucky that it was amicable, and am still good friends with my ex. Regardless…good luck, brother.

  13. Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:53 am

    ‘Wisco— I installed the widget but it’s not showing up properly–I’ve contacted support. But rest assured my man, the countdown is coming!

    • ewisco said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:36 am

      you the man! I remember that at first it seemed like SUCH a long time. but slowly and surely . . .

  14. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:05 am

    On Hairston- how many are there? Fourteen, I think. The problem is that no one knows which is which. We could sign the guy who hit .132 in Low-A.

  15. chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:31 am

    Went back earlier and caught-up on some of the comments from last night. Loved this one from Pawlie (re: the Cortland DA):

    “Yes, I did that, and that’s it. It was my decision. Too bad if you don’t like it, you hypocritical, puritanical phonies. I did lots of things 40 years ago that were stupid, vain, foolish, indulgent, misguided. And LOVED them all. You haven’t?” Granted, would I have the backbone to be that real? Who knows? But how refreshing of does of reality would be. Honestly.

    • ewisco said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:37 am

      I spent my money on wine, women and song. the rest i wasted.

      • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:24 pm

        Old one…but still a classic…

      • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:48 pm

        When Tug Mcgraw got a raise with the Phillies didn’t he day something like, well I’ll probably spend 90% on women and whiskey and the other 10% I’ll probably just waste?
        Whatever the exact quote, a great line that I’ve always wanted to use if (when) I won the Lottery.

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:08 pm

      danke schoen, as Wayne Newton and his glassed hair put it

  16. blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    I always forget to note this here, but another thing that bugs me about ESPN is that they have the following links: ESPN New York, ESPN Boston, ESPN Chicago, and ESPN Los Angeles

    What the fuck? Where is ESPN San Francisco?

    By the by, how’s that ESPN Los Angeles workin’ for ya ESPN? No NFL football team, USC Trojan football team two-year-post-season ban mandated by the NCAA, Dodgers also rans, ditto for Angels, and the Lakers sporting a 3-4, 3rd place record in the Pacific Division. Best team in the LA area? The Clippers. Hilarious.

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:11 pm

      ESPN San Francisco is in Secaucus, New Jersey. Everyone knows that. (I’m doing my best DJLoo, but falling short.)

  17. PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    Put me down for Ryan Ludwick von Beethoven, just ’cause he seems to kill us. Ichiro would be good too. Yes. Happy Saturday. Good luck, The Cardinal.

  18. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:29 pm

    In honor of wine, women, and song and the grand tradition of yoked together German:

  19. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:40 pm

    Oh, and apropos of youthful indiscretion, all of you white boomers can get your yaya’s out until Sir Mick orders this rarity taken down. I saw a VHS bootleg of it several years ago, and it’s worth a look:

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:56 pm

      Good stuff…

  20. chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:46 pm

    UCLA putting a WHOOP-ASS on the University of Spoiled Children…not a UCLA fan, but I like anyone kicking USC’s ass! 1st quarter 17-0. Fuck, I miss baseball…

  21. snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:53 pm

    I don’t want any of those guys on the above list over Pagan. Sign Pagan. Make it happen…

    • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:58 pm

      That is the most sane comment on this topic. Get it done!

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 1:42 pm

        Well, the topic was :”what if”. Most want Pagan back- if it’s somewhat reasonable. Phils, Braves,and Nats are also said to be interested, and none of those teams are cheapskates. The possible length of a deal would be what would worry me- I’d say give him top bucks -12 million, but just 3 years.

      • chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 2:01 pm

        I agree, Michael. You can go back and check it out…I have been saying 3 all along. But, if that 4th year is a “Must” (and I think the other teams with interest will drive it to that), then if the money is reasonable, I say go for it. I would hate to see that one year being the killer for a deal getting done.

  22. chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 12:58 pm

    And it is interesting, I was NOT sold on Crazy Horse early in the year. Many (or a number here) were not, either.

    • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 1:35 pm

      Well, there were a lot of guys here who were for it. Me and Blade led the way. DJLoo loved him right away. I did a poll the day we did the trade and it was like 50-2 *for* the trade of Pagan for Torres. I’ll look it up later, but it was quite one sided. Now maybe some of those *50* turned on him mid year but a lot of us defended him all year…..

  23. chipower9 said, on November 17, 2012 at 1:59 pm

    Flavor – I was absolutely down with the trade. I am more thinking early in his tenure as a Giant. He did not come in and set the world on fire. I think the change in his production was about the same time that they moved him out of the 5 hole and into the lead-off spot. That (before he caught on) is the time I am talking about where I wasn’t necessarily sold on him long-term.

    • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 2:04 pm

      flipping ot the 5 was a good kick start to his year but the day Melky went down (and Pagan had been in about a month long slump if I remember correctly) he started to go off again. I think he went 16 for his next 32 at bats. Huge, *save the season* stuff…….

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 2:14 pm

      Well, he started out the leadoff guy and did poorly. They moved him to the five and he had a huge May and then slumped in June and July. He was moved back to the 1 in early August and even before Melky left in mid-August, Angel went on a tear.

  24. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 2:43 pm

    Stepping away from Pagan for a moment, here are three sets of numbers:

    .310 .370 .881 (HR/RBI 3-16)
    .291 .339 .721
    .288 .351 .760 (13 runs)

    That’s BA, OBP, OPS for the bottom of the order (Belt, Blanco, Crawford) in September. Not earth shattering- but for the 6/7/8- it’s a good 6.8 on the Richter Scale. For all of the deserved praise for Scooter, Pagan, Posey, etc.,the bottom third of the order were as responsible as any factor in putting the division away, IMO.It would have been no surprise at all if all three faded in the heat of a pennant race, instead they thrived…

    • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 3:01 pm

      Well he was 0-5 the day the news broke and Cabrera vanished—the entire LU took a big shit that day. He then went 23 for his next 59. Not too shabby. And while he hit for a higher average in May as oppsed to August (.375 > .342) he was more productive in August (OPS of 1.003 > OPS of .884 in May) scoring a ridiculous 32 runs in August. Thirty-t-w-o. Unreal.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:05 pm

        I was hardly knocking him, I think he was 16 for 50 the first thru the 14th. He stepped it up another notch when Melky left, as I commented on many times. How could one miss it? Even me.

  25. Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 3:19 pm

    I couldn’t find the record for most runs scored in the month of August by a single player so I looked Trout up and the most runs he scored in a month was July, where he also scored 32. His other months were: 21/27/26/21.
    I went back and looked at the year Rickey stole 130 bases (1982) and here were his runs scored by month:
    21,26,20,21,20,11.
    Jeter had a pretty insane year in ’99 with 219 hits and 134 runs scored. They broke down by month like 22,20,25,21,17,29
    Pagan’s August was one for the ages…….

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:08 pm

      Angel’s months were 13-13-12-4-32-21…

      • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:22 pm

        I know. that’s why I tripped out hard on the 32 he dropped on us in August. The record for most runs in a season is a lot— some cat from the 1800’s scored 192 one year. In fact, most of the top runs scored in a season were accomplished by Babe Ruth and a bunch of guys from the 1800’s.
        Since I discount most baseball records set by men when blacks and Hispanic players weren’t allowed to play, I finally stumbled upon Jeff Bagwell’s 2000 season when he scored 152 runs. He came in 7th in MVP voting that year, btw).
        Here were his monthly splits for runs: 26,23,18,24,31,30.
        Impressive.
        But he didn’t have a month of 32.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:38 pm

        Following the 32 with a 21 was impressive as well.
        RBI leaders for August were Scooter (18) Pence (22). Buster (21),Angel (15) Panda had 13 in 16 games as well. Nice 1 thru 5 that month. In fact-awesome.

      • James said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:05 pm

        Bagwell scored 36 runs between August 13th and September 13th during his 2000 season.

      • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:13 pm

        If baseball was counting monthly records from the 13th to the 13th I might find that a little more interesting.

      • James said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:32 pm

        The months are a convenience. You could have a visual graph that tracked an entire season, which would provide another way of seeing the highs and lows over time. The more granular the time breakdown, the more arbitrary it is.

      • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:39 pm

        I totally agree with you but if we’re talking baseball records, and we’re gonna go *months* it’s pretty hard to do anything other than look at the records set in the conventional months we all know and love.

  26. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:20 pm

    Just thought this trailer would help some of the winter blues. All I can add is YEAH!!!

    http://atmlb.com/WjuKw3

    • blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:46 pm

      Good stuff Bozo. I started getting that tingling, shaking feeling by the time it got to Scutaro’s Shawshank Redemption Andy moment. That shit is almost as good as sex. 🙂

      • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:51 pm

        Almost. is the operative word.

      • blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:56 pm

        Of course. Otherwise, I would have to take shit from Pawlie for sheet counts vs. fecking.

      • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:59 pm

        Would silk sheets make sex TOO slippery?

  27. ewisco said, on November 17, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    in looking at Flavor’s breakdown of Pagan’s end of the season, do you really want to give him four years? you think he’s going to go at historic levels again? there’s a cautionary tale there in the making.

    • Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:07 pm

      that’s actually a FANTASTIC point. And while I want Pa….GONE(!) back especially now since his exit would cause problems (see poll above) in our outfield next year, I have always been quite leery of what Pagan would do if he got some financial security. It’s not a knock on him personally, I just think the dude needs a little pressure to succeed. And by *pressure* I don’t just mean *contract year* stuff. Look what he did when Melky went ba-bye. He went off and put together a month for the ages………

  28. Flavor said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    head says Ducks tonight, 61-21.
    Heart says Cardinal 38-28

    • snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:13 pm

      Hey, I saw the Cal/Ducks game. Ducks only laid 59 on Cal. ‘Furd has better offense than Cal, so they should keep the Ducks offense off the field a lot more. Key is to keep the Ducks’ drives to a minimum number of opportunities. If you don’t they wear your D down, and steamroll in the late 3rd and 4th quarters. Ducks maybe only get 45…

  29. blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:24 pm

    Good stuff regarding Pagan’s month to month runs record Flav.

    I have no problem with Pagan getting 4 years and the amount of money it takes to sign him really doesn’t matter to me either. This isn’t like pre no fucking World Series Championships, let’s go solve our problems by spending a gazillion dollars on Barry Zito.

    No, this era is completely different. This is the era where Steve (blade) attempts to go into the fucking Giants Dug Out Store, during a May 2012 game and the line is 75 feet outside the frickin’ door. Oh, I forgot to mention, they were playing the hapless Padres. Being the Giants today means having a license to print money. So, I could give a rat’s ass what they sign Pagan for. Just get it done . . . And if they don’t, I trust Sabes has a good Plan B. Most people who are successful always have a Plan B.

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:49 pm

      I did Angel’s month to month.runs.

      • blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:56 pm

        Yes, you did. Actually, I was referring to his outstanding 3:19pm post, which started the conversation. Nevertheless, thanks to adding to the discussion he initiated.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:03 pm

        That 3:19 *was* a good one, it added to the converstion Snarkk initiated at 12:53,

  30. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    Here’s a quick breakdown of postseason hitting.I’ve given batting averages per series, then total HR, RBI, and runs for the entire postseason. There’s zero doubt that postion player MVP for the entire post season was Panda. Special mentions go to Scooter as NLDS MVP and the game winner in the WS, Crawford for several clutch RBIs and sterling defense, Blanco for his defense, and Buster for the big slam.
    Pagan .150 .242 .125 2 HR 6 RBI 10 Runs
    Scooter .150 .500 .250 0 HR 8 RBI 11 Runs
    Posey .211 .154 .267 3 HR 9 RBI 5 Runs
    Sandoval .333 .310 .500 6 HR 13 RBI 9 Runs
    Pence .200 .179 .286 1 HR 4 RBI 7 Runs
    Belt .077 .304 .077 1 HR 3 RBI 7 Runs
    Blanco .286 .182 .267 1 HR 5 RBI 10 Runs
    Crawford .182 .217 .250 0 HR 7 RBI 3 Runs
    The real MVPs are on the pitching staff, however- and Bochy.
    Vogie 3-0 1.09
    Zits-after the rough start against Cincy, the biggest start of his life to save our season, and then he out pitches the Best Pitcher on the Planet
    Bum- the most unlikely great start of the postseason
    Matt- not at his best , still the Horse
    Timmy- did pretty well replacing Hensley in the postseason, eh?
    Affeldt-0.00 ERA postseason, Cabrera/Fielder/Young- grab some pine, meats!
    Casilla-11 games, 1 ER
    Romo-World Series 3 Games 3 Saves 0 H 0 BB 5 K

    I don’t do “goats”.
    Co-MVPS: Panda, Vogelsong, Romo, Zito

  31. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    *SPOILER ALERT*
    I’m watching the first game of the World Series, fourth inning and the Giants are up.
    Panda has hit two homers off of the “Greatest Pitcher on Earth” – WOW.

  32. unca_chuck said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:13 pm

    Snodfart shuts out Orygun in the 1st quarter. Unheard of. Stanford up 7-0.

    Kelly 0-2 on 4th downs.

  33. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    Watching Blanco make those plays in LF, I’ve decided I’m not that hot on Pagan. I would give him my best offer and if he stalls or comes back with a counter offer, I’d just say thanks for your time, good luck and lose our number.

  34. unca_chuck said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:15 pm

    Shit, are they going to sell the TV broadcasts with the radio calls again?

  35. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    Ewisco brought up being cautious with Pagan, Flavor had said the same awhile back. It *is* a toughie and really it’s all because of the Melkman. They undoubtedly would have gone hard after Melky, kept Pence, and let Angel walk. With Cabrera’s departure, signing Crazy Horse became almost mandatory- and possibly overpaying at that. But looking at his record- 2011 now appears to be the outlier- he’s been ouststanding in 2009, 2010, and this year, Snarkk said it best in that 12:53:
    “I don’t want any of those guys on the above list over Pagan. Sign Pagan. Make it happen…”

  36. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:20 pm

    Bottom of the fourth, two out RBI single from Zito. 5 -0 Giants.
    I can’t believe you guys aren’t watching this game.

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:22 pm

      I’ve watched it about 11 times, John.

      • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:35 pm

        Thanks for sharing Mike. Sorry if I interrupted something important.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:55 pm

        Geez, I just meant I missed this one. The only thing I’m doing imoortant is my toe nails.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:59 pm

        Well, the toe nails and negotiating Pagan’s contract.

  37. unca_chuck said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    If Pagan is keen on staying, would 3 and an option be enough? One would hope.

    That really is the rub. There ain’t anyone much better not named Hamilton, and he’s going to get a boatload, and I don’t want him anyway. Might as well pay Pagan.

  38. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:26 pm

    Signing Pagan for 4 years doesn’t look any riskier than giving Affeldt three at age 33. The chances of both performing consistently well over the duration of those respective contracts don’t seem very high, but as Blade says, this isn’t Zito territory.

  39. snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:30 pm

    Sure there’s risk in signing Pagan to a LT deal at serious coin. But, with the FA options available as listed ably by BF, I don’t see better options. IMO, no assumptions can be made about the readiness of Brown to play at the MLB level next season or ever, or what he can provide. Total crapshoot on that one. If Baer is to believed about what he wants to do with the Giants brand, this is what championship teams do; they pay for the best talent available that will work in the framework of the team. Not stupid pay, but competitive to maybe a premium. Pagan is a good guy and good teammate in the clubhouse, from what I’ve read. He apparently fits in really well with the Latin contingent. Pagan’s not Mickey Mantle, but he’s proved in the reg season and through a tough, pressure cooked playoff run that he can perform both offensively and defensively. He had some down periods, no doubt. But, unless somebody offers him an outrageous amount or contract term of years, get him. He’s 31, should be good for a few more years. I don’t see the risk of him going belly up like Gamer — his stats were padded by the Phills ballpark. We’ve seen Pagan already at ATT, and know what he can do. It’s triples and doubles heaven for this guy. Giants are moving a lot of product, no doubt, so spend the money and hope for the best…

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:35 pm

      Well, it could come down to how much he likes Dungeness Crab and fog. If it’s true that the Phils, Nats, and Braves are also in on him, it’s going to take some major coin.

      • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:40 pm

        Guys like Pagan, or maybe more their agents, should realize: hey, things work in SF. Remember that parade? It could happen again. Sadly, it often just comes down to cash. I really thought that sort of reasoning would’ve worked for Pujols to stay in STL. It did not. Naive of me.

  40. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:32 pm

    Over my martini, I discovered that Mickey Mantle scored 35 runs in May of 1956. But here’s the real gem of my BF-inspired research: Ted Williams scored 31 runs in *3* consecutive months in 1949, failing to reach the magic 32 threshold in what had to be yet another one of the great frustrations in the Splinter’s storied, but flawed career.

    • blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:49 pm

      James, for shit and giggles, who did he have batting behind him? I always thought of Williams as an RBI and batting average guy. Nevertheless, if you are raking like he did back in the day, coupled with having a good hitter or hitters behind you, then yeah, you’re going to score runs as well.

      • James said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:05 pm

        I think Teddy scored a mess of runs because he got on base at a ridiculous rate. I’m not quite sure what you’re suggesting Blade . . . apart from getting on base a lot, do you think Pagan exercised some special run scoring prowess in August that’s missing from his game at other times?

      • blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:18 pm

        No, not at all. I like Pagan and he did well last season overall. Regarding Williams, yes, I would agree with you that he got on base at a ridiculous rate . . . just wondering who followed him in the batting order?

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:53 pm

      Bonds scored 129 four times, but I haven’t found a month over 30.
      The Babe had 34,36, and 38 in 1921.
      Gehrig had 42 in July of 1931.
      OK, here are the single season leaders. I’m getting a headache:

      http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/R_season.shtml

  41. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:32 pm

    Top of the fifth, Zito gets a K for the 3rd out with the fans chanting ZITO.

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:02 pm

      shit now you’re messing w/ my head and the rough draft of my book; I thought for sure our section chanted BARRY BARRY BARRY

  42. PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:37 pm

    My God in Heaven, I’m no film editor but that 1:53 clip from MLB of the Series DVD is perfect, PERFECT, in every fecking frame. And then the 2:01 clip of the parade just adds to it. (I had missed a lot of that.) Shit, Christmas gift lists are so freaking easy the years we win the World Series. I hope it become an annual tradition in the Kokonuts household.

  43. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:38 pm

    Bottom of the fifth, one out, Panda just hit his third HR. 6 – 0 Giants. UNFUCKING believable.

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:43 pm

      …in the bleachers, without the benefit of replay or announcers, we were like, THREE. THREE? NO. THREE. ARE YOU KIDDING? THAT’S HIS THIRD. NO. REALLY. C’MON. YOU SURE? THREE? THREE.

  44. snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    MLB.com has a video compilation of Giants games through the playoffs beginning in the NLCS. I worked through it for about 10 minutes last night with a nice glass of some German schnapps along for the ride. What really came through all the vids to me was the Giants DEFENSE as an aggregate. These guys played just stellar D through those two series. Particularly Crawfish and Blanco. Craw made that one error in the WS that didn’t hurt. Otherwise, he was just a stud with the glove. Blanco, same thing, just great stuff. Everybody else made the routine plays, and some stellar stuff, too. Pagan with catches in the Reds series, Scutaro made a sliding grab and throw to get a guy at first in Detroit that was just a perfect show of 2nd base work (should be a training vid of how to make that play), and Pence did some stuff, too. Plus, that play by Buster to nail the guy at 3rd after the wild pitch in Cincy was HUGE. All in all, an impressive, clutch performance with the gloves. And, to think the defense pretty much stunk the first two months…

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:44 pm

      can you put up a link for that? soaking it all in

      • snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:48 pm

        I’ll try to find it again, there are a few places that have different vid compilations on that site…

      • snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:02 pm

        Pawlie, now I can’t find the same compilation. But, it looks like the same thing can be done this way. Link here: http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?cid=mlb Then, scroll down the page, look on the left and see “Playlists”. Expand the playlist entitled “Postseason Highlights”. You can select the WS, NLCS and NLDS playlists separately. I think the NLCS list looks fantastic. Reminds of how really good that series was. On the bottom right of the page, you’ll see a page list menu from 1-9 and more. Click on that and it will show a ton more of highlights for each series per page, with captions and you can pick and choose what to see. For some reason, I found a playlist last night that conveniently combined the WS and NLCS in one, but I can’t find it now. Maybe it was the schnapps…

      • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:04 pm

        thanks for the info

  45. snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:46 pm

    Bozo, are you watching the official WS DVD that’s already out and on the Giants product list on their website? Whatever it is, does it have Giants announcers doing the voice over, or is it the Fox idiots?…

    • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:55 pm

      Right now I’m just watching MLB.com (Fox idiots). I put up a trailer for the official DVD. According to the FB post that I got earlier, the official premieres Tuesday.

      Blanco with another good grab.

      • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:07 pm

        great grab, great, right below my center field eyes, if I may be so smug [forgive moi]

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:16 pm

        I watch a lot of games often, only because I have the time to do it, I”m certainly not knocking anyone for watching them I’ve watched Shane 187 times as well. Have you watched MadBum’s game? I watched it twice and haven’t rooted against him yet..

      • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:24 pm

        Twin, I’m sure many here have watched these games multiple times. I posted a trailer of the DVD earlier and thought it would be a bit of fun to watch game one and make comments here. Stupid joke? Probably. Do I care? No.
        Cheers.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:28 pm

        John, I have no idea what you are being snippy about. I love hearing your comments about it.

  46. blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 6:57 pm

    I already said this personally to Pawlie, but I will say it here as well . . . YOUR NEW BOOK IS GOING TO ROCK! I LOVED EVERY WORD OF THE FIRST CHAPTER.

    Just me Pawlie, but I think this book will allow your personality and sense of humor to come out much more than your first book. Why? Simply because you’re a fucking funny guy that has lived an interesting life, e.g., who in the hell travels across the United States, not once, but twice, on a quest to see their favorite baseball team? I know much more about you than some of the others here, that has nothing to do with baseball, which I obviously wont share, but in my opinion, your life should be a Panavision movie production. Fortunately, we Flappers get to read an excerpt from your life when your book comes out. I can’t wait! 🙂

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:06 pm

      sheeesh, fecking A thanks, Blade. Now let’s hope some open-shirted, bling-wearing, sunglass-sporting, check-writing Hollywood mogul agrees!!!! Baaaaaaaby!!!!!

      • blade3colorado said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:21 pm

        Hey, it can happen. I truly believe that. I love the storyline.

  47. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:01 pm

    Timmy in for Zito and gets the K. Giants up 6-1.

  48. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:20 pm

    Easy Seventh for Timmy. I don’t want to jinx anything but I’m thinking we have a pretty good chance.

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:26 pm

      TIMMY TIMMY TIMMY TIMMY TIMMY TIMMY TIMMY TIMMY TIMMY

  49. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:30 pm

    MARCO!! base hit scores Pagan after his double. Panda’s up.

    • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:31 pm

      Panda base hit. Four hit night. WOW!

  50. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:31 pm

    See, I watched it 11 times and Timmy got bombed in one, Tigers came back and Huff won it with a HR in the 11th. The he fucked Ma Starrett.

    • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:35 pm

      Must have been some bad Clover milk that night.

      Posey base hit – Giants up 8-1. I don’t think this one is going extras.

      • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:45 pm

        Wrongo-good Clover, better skunkweed. Try it with Ativan.

  51. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:34 pm

    I’ll confess that I don’t get re-watching the playoff and WS games or highlights. I suspect I’ll get satisfaction from seeing moments from 2010 and 2012 being replayed at some later point, somewhat like The Catch for the Niners or Bench taking strike 3 from Fingers. Right now, it doesn’t yet have the aura of history. I hope one day Pablo’s 3 HRs are played more frequently than that tiresome clip of Mays’ 4 bombs.

    • Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:37 pm

      James, the last time I watched “The Catch” game, I was screaming at the TV as Dallas drove down the field at the end there (you’d think I didn’t know the ending).

    • twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:42 pm

      Or his WS catch. I’ve seen about 765 better ones. Blanco had several better ones just this year,

      • PawlieKokonuts said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:50 pm

        right; even Mays has always said it was far from his best

  52. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:40 pm

    Well, sheesh, it’s kind of hard to root for Stanford, knowing that if they win, it helps Notre Dame.

  53. Bozo said, on November 17, 2012 at 7:55 pm

    “Number 55 pitching well as the Giants lead by seven”, can’t believe I just quoted Joe Buck.
    OK. I was just goofing on this WS game one thing, y’all know the outcome so I’ll just go on cheering this awesome game without bothering you guys.
    Pawlie – you sure picked a good one to go to.

  54. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:14 pm

    Great TD for Stanford. Could be overtime coming! Stanford could get some payback on Oregon for the past few seasons.

  55. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:18 pm

    Gift pass-interference call.

  56. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:27 pm

    Overtime!

  57. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:33 pm

    Gotta give it up for the Stanford D tonight. Oregon’s offense has looked out-of-sync most of the night.

  58. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:40 pm

    Stanford wins! Oregon takes a hike. Notre Dame fans are walking around now like cock o’ the walk.
    That’s alright. Notre Dame will lose their bowl game. (grin)

  59. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:43 pm

    “James, the last time I watched “The Catch” game, I was screaming at the TV as Dallas drove down the field at the end there (you’d think I didn’t know the ending).”

    Those who remember history are doomed to repeat it.

  60. twinfan1 said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:44 pm

    We all remember this:

    It’s better than listening to Musburger…

    • zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 8:55 pm

      True.

  61. snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:01 pm

    Well, I predicted Stanfoo would do better against the Ducks than Cal, but not that much better. Excellent effort by the “Furd, and that’s hard for me to say, as a Bears alum. But, that accentuates even more the proposition that Tedford has to go. Bears currently down 28-7 to the Beavers in Corvallis before halftime. If things go as expected, Tedford will be fired tomorrow…

  62. snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:14 pm

    Meanwhile, props to UCLA for trashing ‘SC 38-28. Looks like it could be Stanfuuuurd vs. UCLA in the Pac 12 champ bowl…

  63. ewisco said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:31 pm

    Great game by the stanford defense. shaw is the next dusty baker. too conservative when the game is on the line. you have to win NOW. he depends too much on his kicker. he was bailed out by an oregon kicker who doesn’t actually, kick, very often.

    I’m following the giants on the other channel.

  64. ewisco said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:37 pm

    just had a thought about tedford: he can’t recruit. by that i mean that he’s not the guy who can go into the kitchen or living room and close the deal. remember how the loss of the guy to washington was such a big deal? remember how he came in and took tom holmoe’s guys to near the top? he can’t close the deal. he’s the same guy we see on tv when he’s in the recruit’s home: quiet, nervous and shy.

  65. JBat said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:42 pm

    Blade, Chi, thanks for the encouragement regarding my divorce. Thankfully, neither money nor property was an issue, and there are no kids, but it’s still been tough. She’s refused to talk to me since she filed 7 months ago, but it’s over now and time to start moving forward. Believe me, the Giants run through the season and playoffs was the ultimate elixir. The parade was the icing on the cake.

    Bozo, awesome play by play commentary on game 1. It’s like we were there all over again…:-)

    Twin, the Marathon Man is a classic and that scene is disturbing. I couldn’t go to the dentist for two years after seeing it for the first time. Wanna do something weird? Watch Wuthering Heights & Marathon Man back to back and see if you can tell it’s Olivier in both movies.

    As for the topic of this thread, I became a big Angel Pagan fan last year, and I love his energy, great base running and hard play. My first choice would be to have him back, ideally at no more than a 3 year deal.

    I loved Cody Ross in 2010 – who didn’t – but now at 2 or 3 years? Not so much. He had a good year last season, but in a hitters park.

    With Hairston, it feels like he’s killed us with endless dingers in the past, but I’m tepid about the Giants signing him. He just doesn’t float my boat. Same for Ichiro. I watched him for years in Seattle and have had mixed feelings about his value as a player, especially the last 3 years, but at 39, no way. One thing that’s always bugged me about him is that he doesn’t take walks. That and his age make him a poor choice as a lead off hitter, IMO.

    Ludwick is another guy who had a good year in a hitters park and he’s 34. Anything more than 2 years would make me uncomfortable. He looked tough against the Giants in the NLDS, but how good would his numbers be playing half his games at AT&T?

    Barring an out-of-the-blue signing of Upton, I’d take a flier on Victorino. He’s cut out of the same cloth as Pagan and has been a spark plug throughout his career. I think there’s still a good amount of tread left on those tires. Signing him would also stick it to the Dodgers.

    • zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:55 pm

      No Cody Ross. We caught lightning in a bottle with him in 2010, and that was that. He was horrid in ’11, and the thought of watching him strike out and throw bats into the stands is unbearable.

  66. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:43 pm

    Pierre….he gone.

    “MIAMI — As the Marlins are redirecting and getting younger, the club also is adding a veteran who was a major part of their 2003 World Series championship team.

    According to multiple sources, Juan Pierre has agreed to a one-year, $1.6 million contract.”

    • snarkk said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:25 pm

      Thank GAWD. No way Pierre should be a Giant. Guy can barely make a throw to the infielder for the relay…

  67. zumiee said, on November 17, 2012 at 9:52 pm

    Hamilton apparently wants 7 years/25 million a year. That signs him up until 2019. Obviously Sabean will steer clear of that, and rightfully so.

  68. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:02 pm

    Surely Angel won’t break his sacred bond with little Giants fans over a few Talents?

  69. James said, on November 17, 2012 at 10:17 pm

    Stanford 93, Oregon 27. The percentage of applicants not admitted.

  70. Macdog said, on November 17, 2012 at 11:29 pm

    While Pagan waits for the offers to come pouring in, he’s keeping himself busy with a sideline: http://www.delilahsdennj.com/

  71. zumiee said, on November 18, 2012 at 8:23 am

    New thread.


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