A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball

Body Language: What is it Good For?

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on September 4, 2013

Some of my friends on Facebook were not feelin’ Kieschnick’s boddy language last night, Some examples:

“Who is this Kieschnick dude? He has as much enthusiasm as a corpse.”

“He stands there like a knot on a log.”

Admittedly, this wasn’t the hardest core Giants fan in the world. But she was still watching the game, she gets credit for that.

How much does body language matter to you? Belt’s slumpy shoulders are well documented.

Personally, I think it DOES matter, A lot. Especially when it comes to the other team perceiving your mind set. If an opposing pitchers sees a hitter slumpin’ it up or hang doggin’ their head I think it gives an edge to that pitcher. Same thing if a batter slams his helmet down or breaks his bat over his knee—

If you’re competing you like it when your competitor gets frustrated or *appears* frustrated. That’s a win right there.

And if I was a young player I would give an outward appearance that had a little more energy to it than what Kieschnick is showing these days.

76 Responses

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  1. Flavor said, on September 4, 2013 at 9:26 am

    Sat is Bingo day at the Public House. That could be fun. Plus, it will ensure more fans in attendance to hear Pawlie get interviewed by Marty Lurie on KNBR

    • chipower9 said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:41 am

      Very cool. Do you know approximately when that is going down?

      • Flavor said, on September 4, 2013 at 11:43 am

        2pm.
        I’ll send out an email soon about the Flap itinerary

  2. blade3colorado said, on September 4, 2013 at 9:29 am

    Similar to spying a hot looking chick across the bar, if she gives you the evil eye, you can forget about asking her to dance, much less her parking her shoes under your bed. Conversely, if she gives you that “come (or cum) hither” look where your baloney poney is at attention . . . Well, let’s just say that you’re going to be having a pretty good time that evening. 😉

  3. snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 9:44 am

    I have no idea whether body language makes any difference. Like I said before, tho, when somebody like Reggie Jackson goes off on himself for striking out in the world series, I like that.
    Anyway, if Posey’s finger is messed up, get Monell in there. See what he can do. They only score 2 runs a game with Posey in there, so WTF not?…

  4. willedav said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:08 am

    I dunno, I never cared for showing anger and emotion to the other team. Boys on traveling teams I coached did this regularly when things didn’t go their way, and I didn’t like it. I don’t want the other teams to see that, that they could be easily rattled and go into *I’m gonna get you sucka* mode cuz somebody blocked or picked them or blew by them. You can’t play that way and be effective for very long. As an assistant it was my job to get them to calm down on the bench and keep them away from head coach who would have let them have it.

    Yes, SF didn’t score enough to win and the RISP ABs were awful; Pagan did his part and no one could move him over or get him in. But..Tigers and Red sox played a 2-1 game in Fenway yesterday and neither of those teams have a pathetic offense. Cards got beat 1-0 by Homer Bailey and Reds in bandbox Cincy. Cards btw have 4 guys in LU hitting over .300 and in top ten BA in the NL. All were in the LU yesterday and they still couldn’t score.

    And I have a feeling a lot of the same guys from yesterday (plus Scut and Crawford) will be in Giants LU next season, so you better have as much pitching as you can get ahold of.

    • Irish Kevin said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:21 am

      I agree, until the next PED comes out, Pitching rules the day.

    • chipower9 said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:45 am

      I don’t expect to see much change in next year’s starting line-up. Here is the way I see it: C – Buster, 1B – Belt, 2B, Scoots, SS – MudBug, 3B – Pablo, RF – Pence (yeah, I think they resign him), CF – Pagan, LF – Platoon of Blanco and fill in the blank (I know this will piss off snarkk and others wanting a quality OFer, and I agree, but that is what I believe we will see).

      They have to add at least one starter (and that is IF they ink Tim and Vogey).

      I think a couple of pieces of the bullpen need to be swapped out, too.

      • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:09 pm

        I don’t doubt that Sabes will do better than the Machi, Rosario, Moscoso, Miijares group. That group doesn’t cut it. Hembree’s a start on that effort, looks like. Although his FB velocity was noted as down to 92 last night from the usual 95+, for some reason. Hopefully a blip…

      • chipower9 said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:56 pm

        Rosario and Mijares, yeah, but Machi has actually been pretty good (2.72 ERA and 1.18 WHIP). But definitely, the bullpen needs a tune-up.

  5. unca_chuck said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:14 am

    I think there’s a time and a place for showing emotion. Within reason of course. Beating up a BP phone is over the top. Then again, the walk-off celebrations are stupid beyond belief.

    • Irish Kevin said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:23 am

      As well as TD dances??

    • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:33 am

      When did these walk off things start? I have no clue. I certainly don’t remember that in the 70s and 80s. Of course, the Giants didn’t do much “walking off” in that era anyway. But, the walk-off beat downs on the guy that gets the homer or hit are just ridiculous now, and dangerous. It makes no sense to me. Other stuff, too. You know how the Giants OFers now do a synchronized jump up against each other in the outfield after the last out of a win to celebrate? That’s a great way to tear an ACL…

  6. chipower9 said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:49 am

    In general I don’t like the showing of emotion. To me it can give your opponent insight to your emotions, and they could take advantage.

    If you read one of the recent “Giants” magazines, there was a piece on Posey, and he talked about how his dad suggested that he not show emotion (your opponent should not know if you are having your best day or worst), and he says he lives by that.

  7. James said, on September 4, 2013 at 11:00 am

    Arrogant, impassive, self critical – it just doesn’t much matter when you are playing a game where doing the most basic things requires an extraordinary amount of concentration and skill.

  8. twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 11:05 am

    i’ve mentioned kieschnick’s body language, or maybe more properly, lack of it, before. belt’s ‘slumped shoulders’ ,which just accentuated his normal posture, didn’t/doesn’t concern me a bit. with roger we have a guy who regularly misses bp fastballs by two feet. i’d love to see some slumped shoulders, maybe a hint of a frown, any sign that he’s concerned about being terrible. i’m not asking for water cooler destruction, even a ‘oh, darn it’ would be a good start,..he’s a guy i’ve touted for years, btw.
    last night and the other games since he’s returned, are why i wanted to see pagan return this year- hoping to see the pagan from most of 2012, and not the one from early 2013.

    • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 11:14 am

      They need to get Kiesch the proverbial 100 ABs before making any kind of prognosis, IMO. He’s at 77. But, it doesn’t look good. He looks like yet another Giants farmhand that blows when he finally faces MLB competition. That many ABs, with one triple, and NO doubles. No doubles. The guy showed pop in the minors, but totally gone here so far. Noonan appears similarly far from the talent level required to produce as a major leaguer…

      • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 11:33 am

        i’m not sure why nick is back- and he’s another i’ve liked, btw. he’d gone totally feet up in fresno- .227 july, .194 august. he actually did show something early in the year here, but after april he was awful. i feel for him- remember he hit the hr that was overturned on replay. that might have been the only one he’ll ever have.

      • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:13 pm

        Noonan’s looking like a 40 man casualty in the offseason to make room for somebody else. Kiesch, too, unless the lightbulb goes off ASAP. Kiesch is 26, Noonan is 24. At their ages, it’s time these guys either “get it” and show promise, else they don’t “have it” to get…

      • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:24 pm

        well, there *may* be 3 outfield spots-one corner, 2 reserve- to be contested next spring, i doubt that they’ll bail on roger before that. the guy who looks best striking out is perez- nice, pert trot to the dugout 😉 great ‘d’, as well. i’d like to see him grab a reserve spot. he brings enougn to the table that he doesn’t have to hit much as a 5th outfielder, emergency infielder.

  9. blade3colorado said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:16 pm

    None of our minor league guys excite me, especially the 8 call ups. Other than Twin and Flavor – who also probably know most, if not all of the other MLB teams elite minor league phenoms as well) – I keep track of everyone’s minor league call ups due to my fantasy league participation.

    Where is our Mike Trout? Taijuan Walker? Wil Myers? Yasiel Puig? Sorry, none of our call ups excite me and consequently, I don’t expect too much out of them.

    • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:37 pm

      he’s not in that rarified company you cite , but mac williamson is getting some attention-not just from me. he’s big, 6-5 240, pretty fast, good arm. he was voted as the cal league’s best power prospect by the league’s managers. next year at richmond should tell the story as prospect or suspect.

  10. chipower9 said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:20 pm

    Yeah, Kieschnick is a head-scratcher, and like Twin and many others here, I have touted him, too. Dude had awesome numbers in the minors. And I think it takes more than 100 AB to get a read on a guy. I have heard from some of the quote-unquote “experts” that a guy needs a solid 500 ABs for you to make a good judgement on his skills (or lack thereof). But 77 AB, 26Ks and only one EB hit (a triple) ain’t gonna cut it. I am sure he’ll still get the invite to ST.

    The Giants announced who would be playing in the AFL recently, and I was a bit surprised at the names (or who was missing that I thought would go). Here is a link that list the preliminary roster for the Scottsdale Scorpions:

    http://sanfrancisco.giants.mlb.com/mlb/events/afl/club.jsp?team_id=544

    • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:48 pm

      Kiesch has almost 2000 PAs in 5 minor league seasons. So, IMO he’s had enough ABs and minor league experience that if he were a real prospect, he would not be looking this overmatched at the MLB level after 80 ABs up here. The lack of pop of any kind is very troubling, and the inability to make contact in clutch situations is obviously uncool. Maybe he’s enough for a #5 OFer, but I wouldn’t bet on it at this point…

      • blade3colorado said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:57 pm

        You beat me to it – I agree that if he hasn’t figured it out by now, then he isn’t likely to later. Even Nate Schierholtz is still suspect in my mind for two reasons: 1. He plays half his games in Wrigley; and, 2. He still hasn’t figured out lefthanders (check out the Cubs roster for today’s game – he is sitting. Why? Lefty is pitching). In short, if he came back to SF, he still wouldn’t have much of a clue IMO.

    • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:20 pm

      Cody Hall? Pitcher from Richmond. The guy is 25 1/2 years old, what’s he doing on the AFL roster?…

      • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:31 pm

        he has a good shot of pitching here in 2014. he’s only been a pro since 2011.

      • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 2:38 pm

        As what, middle relief?…

  11. chipower9 said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:23 pm

    Interesting that the only Giant IFer going to the fall league is Villalona.

    There was a piece on Krick on the latest “Inside the Clubhouse” that I have mentioned. Seems like a good kid who has his head screwed-on straight, and he supposedly has some awesome stuff. Will be interesting to see how he progresses.

  12. salty said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:41 pm

    To me showing emotion and positive body language are separate things.
    Take Will Clark, for example. He didn’t need to break a bat to let you know he was bleeping pissed after some bad ab’s. His eyes, jaw and that strut conveyed that.
    Of course not everyone has his talent or quick success, but you still like to see a young hitter continue to hold their head up high. They don’t have to break or throw anything.

  13. salty said, on September 4, 2013 at 12:52 pm

    I still think Hembree’s development could be key. If he could take over the closer’s role (admittedly a big if) they could package Romo for a bat. I love Sergio and would not do it lightly but who else can they move who has value and more importantly, they have someone to plug in? Romo is also a FA end of 14.
    If Pablo goes, there’s a hole at 3rd. (Imo, Posey at 3rd ain’t realistic)

    • chipower9 said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:00 pm

      Since we are talking hypotheticals here, IF Hembree did turn into a serviceable closer, I would not be quick to try and move Romo. It would have to be a damned good offer, as I would like to see him revert back to the set-up role in the 8th.

    • blade3colorado said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:06 pm

      Good comment Salty. I would take that risk for a few reasons: 1. Closing takes a unique player, which has little or nothing to do with the player’s pedigree; 2. We have very few trade pieces I would personally risk giving up – Romo is one of the few I would; and, 3. Even if Hembree can’t close, someone else in-house or a cheap ass free agent can close (see the 32 MLB closers currently on rosters – hardly any of these guys have a pedigree. A closer’s attitude is a big, big, prerequisite).

    • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:26 pm

      i wouldn’t worry at all with casilla closing and hembree setting up, with heath eventually moving into the closer’s role. it would depend on what romo *plus* could bring. but we need a couple of reliable middle relief guys, right now we have a boatload of mop up relievers, and two loogies forced to face right handers, too. imo.

  14. twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:42 pm

    1. Joaquin Arias (R) 2B

    2. Juan Perez (R) CF

    3. Brandon Belt (L) 1B

    4. Hunter Pence (R) RF

    5. Pablo Sandoval (S) 3B

    6. Brett Pill (R) LF

    7. Hector Sanchez (S) C

    8. Brandon Crawford (L) SS

    9. Tim Lincecum (L) P

    • Alleykat said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:58 pm

      Typical Bochy,Perfect spot to give Jonny Monell a start, but nooooo way I’m giving the kid a look.

      • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 2:14 pm

        hector deserves *his* extended look. monell will get some playing time.

      • salty said, on September 4, 2013 at 2:52 pm

        And Stultz, a lefty, is starting.

      • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 3:08 pm

        It might be a good idea to have Hector catch Tim because of the nastiness factor of the pitches. He’s the toughest guy on the staff to catch. Just my two cents…

  15. Alleykat said, on September 4, 2013 at 1:54 pm

    Elsbury CF
    Pagan LF
    Pence RF
    Peguero,Kiesh, Blanco reserves …

    • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 2:06 pm

      they won’t carry more than 5 outfielders, kat. for a lot of this year, they only carried 4. and 3 outfielders with long term contracts… it”s hard imagine they’d ever do that. we’d get *at least* one rowand.

  16. twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 2:30 pm

    the way hector has played since his return makes him a legit possibility to be a starting catcher- somewhere. i hope they play him as much as possible the rest of the way. we’ll see if it lasts but he’s even done something that very few young hackers do – he’s become a patient hitter.
    i’m out, enjoy the game.

    • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 2:41 pm

      He looks like he’s got a MLB swing, if he brings the hackage down. And, has pop. He needs to get and stay in shape, and work hard on his defensive skills in the offseason, instead of playing Wball in Venez. He surely must realize he has a real shot at a starting job here in SF down the road with Buster most assuredly not going to catch much longer, IMO, with Buster’s $167M deal looming large. Every ding to Buster’s mask, fingers and body brings that day sooner…

  17. PawlieKokonuts said, on September 4, 2013 at 3:33 pm

    BULLETIN: Just heard back from Marty Lurie. 2pm Saturday. Public House. Confirmed. Yay!

    • snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 3:36 pm

      You’re batting leadoff, dude. Awesome…

  18. snarkk said, on September 4, 2013 at 3:36 pm

    I think the only guy that had body language I cared about was Rohand. If you can call that stance “body language”. Whatever language it was, said the same thing — I’m not batting in the big leagues, I’m taking a dump. Which he never changed in 4+ years, despite the suckage. A stance, BTW, about which we never heard a peep of criticism out of Kruk. If Belt took that stance, Kruk would verbally draw and quarter ‘im. In SF history, maybe the worst combination of stance and results ever…

  19. Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 4:09 pm

    Long first inning for Tim, but I’m OK with only giving up the one run.

  20. Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 4:44 pm

    Attaway Mr Pence

  21. Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 4:47 pm

    Hackin’ Hector

  22. unca_chuck said, on September 4, 2013 at 5:18 pm

    Hector should go talk to Panda’s brother.

  23. Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 5:47 pm

    Come on BP, please shut these fuckers down.

  24. Flavor said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:05 pm

    Listening to the radio guys on the way home, they weren’t easy on Mijares, saying his pitches were way off the mark and then noting that he has the worst strand rate of any reliever in the BP. I really need a W from Timmy tonight, there is a 4 pt swing on P points and I’m only 2 wins off of that……

    • Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:10 pm

      Mijares had bad body language, Tim not so bad. You should be OK.

  25. Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:16 pm

    Now, Pablo’s body language is damn good. IMO.

  26. Flavor said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:36 pm

    this was a great example of our pitching gargling gallons of mayonaise tonight…..

  27. Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:36 pm

    PANDA!!!!!!!!

  28. Bozo said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:48 pm

    Game! Nighty night.

  29. Macdog said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:51 pm

    Had to get one in San Diego in this thrilling battle for 4th, so Mission Accomplished!

  30. salty said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:51 pm

    Helluva battle for 4th.

    • twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 7:17 pm

      they’d better be going for 3rd..

  31. Flavor said, on September 4, 2013 at 6:57 pm

    So Pablo only seems to hit bombs if it’s 3 in a game. WTF? Nice job, try spacing some of them out next year so you show power ALL year long, not in single games……..

  32. twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 7:07 pm

    hey, panda can get off the diet now 😉

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on September 4, 2013 at 8:30 pm

      As the current parlance has it, “I know, right?”

  33. twinfan1 said, on September 4, 2013 at 8:15 pm

    craig, thanks for your kind words last night. for reasons that have nothing to do with baseball and blogging and everything to do with ‘real life’ , i love ‘big flavor’, guys. hope you all have a great time at the flapalooza…

    • Flavor said, on September 4, 2013 at 8:25 pm

      Pawlie has a confirmed interview with Marty Lurie on his live KNBR show at the Public House so we will get video of that for sure. Lots of pictures will be taken later, hopefully not mugshots. 🙂 But whatever, I’ll post those, too.

    • PawlieKokonuts said, on September 4, 2013 at 8:29 pm

      Aw, Mike, I was hoping to meet you. You will truly and literally be there in spirit. But you’ll be missed.

  34. PawlieKokonuts said, on September 4, 2013 at 8:27 pm

    Just catching some of the hearty comments here. I was “out of pocket” for several hours and called my main man Macdog for a final score. YOIKES!

  35. Flavor said, on September 4, 2013 at 8:33 pm

    I have a list of Flappers who are coming to Flapalooza 3.0 but I put it together in my mind which can sometimes be a little half-assed. If you are coming, and you’re going to be in the section we’ve discussed, please email me at bigflavor77@gmail.com and I will send you the itinerary of the day/night/sf county jail visitor phone number…….

  36. Macdog said, on September 4, 2013 at 9:04 pm

    First Timmy pitched a no-hitter at Petco, and now Pablo with the 3 HRs. I wonder if that’s ever happened before, a team getting both on the road vs. the same team?

  37. James said, on September 4, 2013 at 9:19 pm

    I’m fine with Pablo bunching all of his homers in clusters of 3 per game, as long he has 8 of those games.

  38. Alleykat said, on September 4, 2013 at 10:43 pm

    No problem with Pablo’s “Body Language” tonight.What a performace!!
    3 Bombs 6 RBI’s ..Nightmares for Bud Black and SD “PRICELESS”

  39. eddacker said, on September 5, 2013 at 12:22 am

    AND the youngster Juan Perez getting two hits and a stolen base.
    FUN game


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