Filling My Glass To At Least the Half Full Line
Andre Baggerly is listing off his offense rankings for the NL West and the Giants checked in at a surprising 3rd. At least, at first I was surprised. The part of his article that had me double taking was the “Who’s New”/”Who’s Gone” list.
Who’s New: Michael Morse
Who’s Gone: Torres, Pill, Peguero, Monell, Francoeur and Tanaka.
That “Who’s Gone” list is spectacular insofar as its underwhelming nature. Talk about 6 guys who were either done or were never going to do anything at the mlb level. And say what you will about Morse and his wrist and his fragility, but he is still not far removed from 2 or 3 productive seasons.
Paper can always be a deceptively manufactured material, but on PAPER the offense going into 2014 doesn’t look half bad–as long as you are a *line up half full* kinda guy. And as long as not a single one of our starting position players gets injured, we look great on paper.
The Dodgers are a different story. They could have 5 guys go down and freaking bring back Matt Kemp or Andre Ethier off the DL to plug into the starting line up. They’re like the Miami Hurricanes of Jimmy Johnson/Dennis Erickson years. The second string guy is better than the first string guy. Or at least, just as good.
And I think I just nailed why I’ve posted so many negative posts this off season. I’m jealous of the Dodgers depth. I’m going to try to stop worrying about what they’ve done or what they’re doing and just hope we don’t suffer any major injuries in 2014. What would be the point of taking any other stance?
A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball 
I’m not jealous of the Dodgers. They’re stuck with the same blue unis year after year. Last I checked they haven’t won much for decades.
I’m more of a my cup runneth over type. This lineup is stacked and the pitchers will benefit from a long off season.
Depth? Where–they dumped all their bench guys from last year, Punto Hairston Jr (retired I think) and Schumaker, and let Young who also retired and M. Ellis go, right?
Hanley (who was out long time last year) at SS, who do they have other than the Gordon kid who has flopped? Kemp still isn’t recovered, and Ethier is a $17 mil platoon player. Crawford was hurt too, and the only bench OF I recall is the Van Slyke kid. Who backs up old man Uribe? Who takes 2b if the Cuban kid struggles?
LA has great pitching and a solid LU that hit well last year, but I must be missing something if Flav is worried about their bench. Plus, if 2 trips is sitting on it, SF has an edge right there.
well, having Ethier as a 4th outfielder is a luxury. He’s a 20+ hr guy and we don’t have a 4th OF (or even a 3rd outfielder) who can boast that. And Dee Gordon is hardly a wash out, he’s had injury problems. He could easily steal 40 bases this year.
Good thread, Flav.
Nip – the Bums actually have a new uni this year. Instead of their road greys that has “Los Angeles” on it, they will also have an alternate that says “Dodgers” (like their home whites). They could have as many uniforms as the fucking Oregon Ducks, but they’re still the Bums and smoke pole.
I’m not sure I am as optimistic as Dirt (whatever the fuck he is drinking, I’ll have a double), but I am optimistic (I like to think of myself as an optimistic realist). The line-up looks good. If our boys stay healhty (as Flavor mentions), and put up numbers that they have/are capable of, then I feel good about the offense. They also must play good, solid, fundamental defense, too (last year was somewhat of a train wreck in this regard).
I am optimistic about the pitching, too. Looking forward to my time in Scottsdale and seeing if anyone makes some noise re: a bench position. One of the games we are seeing is a split squad with the Bums in their yard. This may be an opportunity to see some of the bubble guys. The bench definitely has to be better than last year.
Only 8 days until pitchers and catcher report. GIDDY UP!
The year is still young Chi. I’m optimistic. That and I’ve been sick the last few days and drinking a lot of nyquil.
Speaking of benches…here is an article from Baggs on that topic…
http://tinyurl.com/lw83n9c
This is just plain fucked-up and frosts my ass something fierce. With all the questions around Vogie, you throw him a guaranteed contract, while this guy is still sitting there. And now, two of the three finalist are in our division. ARGH…
http://tinyurl.com/mw2sxtr
The latest supposed asking price by Arroyo’s camp is 2 years at 22 mil…
No thanks. I’ll take Vogie at 1/6m with something to prove.
Somebody can tell me if other teams came after Voggy, but I’m unaware of that. So, giving him $5+M guaranteed after he’s looking pretty much done just makes little sense to me, unless it’s make up dollars for previous performance, plus an assumption that Voggy would do whatever it takes offseason to get that aged arm ready to go. I will be pleasantly surprised if he isn’t hammered early and often in ST. I assume Sabes has a backup plan if Voggy turns into a mess. Hopefully, a better backup plan than the one for Pagan going down…
I know that the Phillies offered for Ryan and I think Texas as well. Ryan’s season last year was derailed by 3 things last year. The WBC (which played havoc with our roster ( 8 of the 9 players we sent had injuries of at two months duration. Marco was injured all year with the back problems he initially got in the WBC. Second Ryan lost his mechanics after the WBC was finding them again the game in which he broke his hand. Back in August playing catch-up and it never came together for him. It is easy to say that he is 36 and past it but too many things derailed him last year and it is impossible to say that he is past it. He had location problems along with a decrease in velocity. That’s a lack of sharpness which can be contributed to the long lay-off in the middle of the season. A loss of velocity is not a death knell if you have good location and movement which can return with rest and conditioning.
Signing Bronson Arroyo, for example, to a long term dea,l 3-4 years (which is what he was wanting in the beginning of the off season — And Sabean likes to get deals done early) was not what the Giants need. They need bridge-gappers like Ryan and Tim Hudson to get us to 2015-16 when the young arms should be Major League ready.
Coincidence or just timing? Last night before nodding off i did some comparisons with other teams in the NL, looking at the Giants offense. Baggarly is being conservative. Way i see it is that SF has nothing less than the #3 offense in the league, not merely the division. Without checking his site, i have no ideas whose offense he ranks as second in the NLW. AND, as Williedav points out, the LaBumbos offense IF everything clicks and everyone stays healthy, MAY be the envy of the division.
So lets take a brief look at what SF brings to the plate. Two holes, if you can strettttch a bunch. Scutaro slipped some last season, mostly due to injuries and as he’s getting slightly long in the tooth, may be another stretch to regain is Championship ’12 form. As a shortstop with pretty decent defensive tools Crawford is not expected to be a heavy in the tractor-pull entries. But consider the other six.
A healthy Pagan is at the very least a league-average leadoff man, probably a couple notches better. He’s also a good RBI man. If he goes for only a one-year contract and looking at what Freddy Freeman got from the Bravos, BB9 in his age 26 season, could go monster mash this year. He’s got the big buck in his sight and his forefinger on the trigger. Bulked up, Beefy and decently well-rested, the 2012 MVP is ready to bust out over a whole season. Buster should clean-up, all right.
Plenty of backing behind Buster. Slimmed and trimmed and not looking particularly Pandaesque as a result, Pablo is also targeting the bucks and in his walk year to boot. If his vision problems have settled down and with half the Dominican GDP as his possible reward Sandoval should get plenty of opportunities to knock em in and keep the rally going. Which gets us to a very happy camper. Reverend Pop-eyes, who just got the big bucks, is not gonna slack off as a result. He may be even more motivated. Pence will drive opposing pitchers crazy with his bughouse stare alone. Then there’s the magic of the three-hit bat, splintering a seeing-eye double and clearing the bases. Talk about a fear factory.
Then there’s more ~ or should we say Morse. Injuries and such brought him down from the heights he had achieved a couple of years back. But he’s still early 30’s and could have a lot of quality baseball left in him. As an RH thumper, the McCovey Cove field effect should not affect him in any significant manner. Like the other five guys in the middle of the lineup, the Beast has something to prove.
Potentially the Giants are a monster offense, featuring no fewer than five guys likely to pound out 20 or more taters and that in one of the most power challenging parks in baseball. Dominated by the NLC last season, they are likely to turn the tables on the road this year. If the Rotation were as dominant as the one SF sported in ’11 this team would wiln 110 games. That’s cussin on accounta the 2014 offense more closely resembles that of the ’27 Murderer’s Row than it does the hitters on the ’11 Giants.
Best case scenario is that the lonnnng lineup the team features this season will so inspire Matt Cain, the hard-luck posterboy with that pile of 2-1 defeats over a string of seasons, that he bears down like a morgan in full warhorse gallop with his eyes on 20 wins. Cain goes big and the rest of the Rotation flows into form. It’s that simple.
That’s a great post stix…I can always count on you to bring stability and sense to this blog.
Thanx, wswin: Sometimes it’s good to stand back and try to get the big picture.
I think so! If our guys can stay healthy it is a really deep line-up! Morse has prodigious power. It has me cautiously optimistic!!
I’ll have what he’s having.
All I know is the Dodgers are really a house of cards. Any one thing could send them into a tailspin. Grienke’s a head case, but their SPs are the bomb. But, pitchers being pitchers, any one of them could go down for the count. HanRam is the deal. The rest? Another shakely foundation. Puig stirred the drink for a little while, but he’s soon to be enrolled in the Justin Bieber school of how to handle oneself in the glare of the spotlight. Crawford and Uribe are fragile at best. Ethier and Kemp are the blaah and blaaher twins of the team. I see a let-down for them.
Agreed, Chuck. Also, they’re a clusterfuck of major ego-trippers that can implode at any time. Sure, Puig lit a fire under their ass and HanFuck had a great season but I don’t see them going on the streak they went on last year. They may or may not do well but I don’t see them being nearly as successful as they were last year. I also see the Giants doing much better this year, being contenders again. The Snakes will also have a rebound year. And the Poodres will still suck.
And I predict Nipper will get drunk this weekend. Burrrrrrrrrrrrp
Agree completely! If they get off to a slow start anything can happen! And we will see if Puig’s ego and inflated self-importance given to him by ESPN and MLB being so far up his….well you know will allow him to realize he has to make adjustment that all rookies heading into their sophomore year (not named Buster Posey — who in his Sophomore year won everything — save the GG.) have to make.
Unc: Great line on Puig and Bieber. lol.
Ethier and Gordon, Flav? Just my take but I think you are giving these guys way too much cred.
Ethier starts in CF (I’d rather have Pagan), since Kemp still isn’t healthy. Shame cuz he deserved MVP imo over FedEx Braun, but he is a shell of former self.
Ethier hit 12 HRs last year, and has total of 43 in last 3 seasons, over 1600 ABs. He does have nice OB, but as a LH middle order guy he puts up Belt numbers and sucks vs. LHP. I think Belt hits more HRs than Ethier this year.
Gordon sucks. In 140 some games in his career at SS he has made 35 errors. He’s way erratic and throws ball all over the place. Last year he hit .234 year before that .228; OPS last year .612 year before .561. Blood cannot steal 1b. Hanley days at SS are likely numbered anyway, but if he goes down LA takes a big hit.
Position starters overall imo SF loses one spot in the OF and likely one in the IF to LA, and gains a big edge at C. Giants bench might not be great, but Blanco/Morse Arias/Abreu Hector isn’t worse than what LA has,
Found a music *Good read* at lib last night, “Respect Yourself: Stax Records and the Soul Explosion.” Booker T. Jones and his MGs were really Memphis HS buddies and the two relatives that started the company were flying by seat of their pants getting it started.
I’m certainly biased, but Stax and Atlantic Muscle Shoals music was just one part of the music I dug from ’60s, which has never been matched: Doors Hendrix Cream, SF sound of Santana Dead Quicksilver, Stones and the Brits other than Beatles (Kinks Yardbirds Animals Mayall), Dylan, Blues re-emergence, Motown. Top that in any era!
I’m holding my opinion until I see midway through Spring Training. The optimists believe that last year’s offensive cratering was an aberration, made worse by the loss of Pagan. Plausible, though how do we explain the Cardinals in the WS — they played basically one less week than the Giants in 2012 — why weren’t they “out of gas” in 2013? The pessimists say the Giants are another significant injury to one major cog (starter or position guy) away from another lousy finish. I’m open to suggestion as ST peels the onion, and we get a look at whether this Morse shot in the dark shows actual promise, not paper promise. I agree with BF and just about all neutral observers that the Giants bench remains laughably weak. Arias and Blanco are the bench highlights at this point — BFD, with Hector’s progress a wild card in that mix…
I think Perez could provide some spark as a 5th OFer…
I don’t disagree. His defense and arm appear more than solid from his short stints at playing last season. As for offense, totally unproven — IMO looks very questionable …
Well, tough to make any judgement on less than 100 PAs. If he cuts down on his Ks and takes a few more BBs, that would help. I think the kid has shown enough, that if he doesn’t go tits-up in ST, he deserves a shot at that spot.
I do think that if Morse proves anywhere close to solid, that will help Blanco’s production. He tires as the season goes along, maybe that would stop his penchant for long stretches where his offense just disappears…
It’s gonna be between Perez and Roger Special K for the 5th OF spot, my money is on Perez , better arm,better speed, better D his job to lose Imo.
I agree Kat. Kiesch got a shot last year, and did not really impress. His calling card is supposed to be the ability to put a charge in the ball…didn’t happen. But agree…he’ll get a good look during ST.
He hit with power in AAA I saw him do it! but his power completely dried up in September!
Kiesch showed nada last season. If he’s part of the 2014 plan, we’re hosed…
Flav’s post reminded me of the receiver Brett Perriman, who practically never got on the field at “The U,” but then had some big seasons in the NFL. Like 100 catch (or close to it) type seasons. The talent level they had back then was insane.
Swen Nater at UCLA.
Saw larry nance jr. play for Wyoming last night, highlights of Tecs pulling one out on late 3 vs. Boise. At least they don’t play on a blue court.
What…no smurf basketball…
“though how do we explain the Cardinals in the WS ā they played basically one less week than the Giants in 2012 ā why werenāt they āout of gasā in 2013?”
A case could be made that the Cards got a strong youth infusion last season, in pitching and at secondbase. That was enough to help them get back to the playoffs, and go deep into the playoffs.
zum, I’m going to try this season not to bust on the Giants so much in comparison to how the Cards run their organization. You’re not helping me in that possibly doomed effort… š
Hey, I admire how the Cards run their club, but WTF…the Giants (Sabean, Evans, Tidwell and crew) really are not chopped liver. It was the Cards against whom the Giants rallied to win three elimination games. Yeah, “on paper” the Cards are the model club. But as we all know, the games are not played on paper. When was the last time the Cards won two world series titles in a three year span (1942-1944)…
Chi, in 2000 – 2013, the Cards went to 10 NLDS, 8 NLCS and won 4 of those. Same period the Giants to 5 NLDS, 3 NLCS and won 3 of those (2002 and 2012 won against the Cards, which is cool). Same period both won 2 WS. So, I agree, yes, the Giants have been far from chopped liver. But, 8 vs 3 NLCS runs is a huge difference in terms of success and opportunity to win it all. Going into this season, the Cards payroll is about $30M less than the Giants and they’re geared up again to make an NLCS run. Plus, they’ve got a minor league organization everybody ranks in the top 5. By those objective comparisons of the two franchises, St. Louis is clearly the better and more consistently well-managed organization. IMO, it’s by far the best organization in all of MLB. I’m a Giants lifer, but IMO the Giants would do well to figure out what the Cards are doing in their minor leagues and in their pro player assessment methods, and then follow those approaches…
I would agree that the Cards are the model franchise in MLB. But I don’t think the Giants deserve some of the criticism leveled at them. Can they improve? You bet. In my book, regardless of what you are doing, if you are not trying to get better, then get the fuck out.
I’m liking Rudy Gay. He arrived in Sacramento with not much attention from the media, and has been exactly what the Kings needed: a go-to scorer that can create his own shot at crucial times, and exudes an overall confidence the team needs. I’d still like to see an upgrade at point-guard. Maybe I’m one of the few that doesn’t believe in Isaiah Thomas as a starter. I like him as a spark-plug type of sub, and then get him out of there at the end of close games. He’s a bad decision-maker in that situation. The Kings have lost a bunch of close games, with all kinds of flubs at the end, and not just Isaiah’s. Their record could realistically be much better.
I feel sorry for Michael J. Fox for his show getting cancelled. It wasn’t a good show; it was a sit-com that wasn’t funny, but still, it’s sad news, given how brave he was to try it. It also starred the actress who played Hank’s wife Marie, in Breaking Bad. Speaking of Hank, the actor who portrayed him is in a lousy show, too, but his gets good ratings for some inexplicable reason. His show, “Under The Dome,” returns this summer for its second season. The book was good, the TV show is not, although the TV show is very entertaining with unintentional humor.
Hank would kick MJF’s ass for taking up with Marie. Is she still always wearing purple?
I miss BB — a lot…
Some good BB-related news you may have heard, it looks like the Better Call Saul show is a go. It’ll be billed as kind of a BB prequel, which opens up the possibility of bringing back some of the BB crime characters, like Tuco, Gus, and that guy who ended up with his severed head stuck on the back of a tortoise, one of the most haunting scenes in the history of television.
Jonathan Banks (Mike the fixer) is onboard for the show!
http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/media/jonathan-banks-is-on-board-for-better-call-saul-who-else-should-join/2163247
zum, thanks for the link. That is indeed good news. I think.
Saul’s character and his supporting characters were so awesome in short stints, I’m hesitant as to how he’ll go over in an hour format. Kind of like Kramer on Seinfeld, then when Kramer got his own show — wow, that stunk. I’d hate to have that happen here, and tarnish some of the characters that were so great on BB, especially Jesse and WW if they come back for a few one-off episodes. I wouldn’t mind more of Badger and Skinny Pete, those guys were hilarious. It would be weird to see WW again in a prequel situation. I’ll admit, I’m conflicted about this. If Vince Gilligan is involved, at least it’ll be a good attempt at getting it right on the writing side. I suspect they’ll do a slew of unrelated episodes week to week, with independent story lines, but somehow all connected at some higher level. Kind of like X-Files. Gilligan wrote and directed a ton of X-Files (more than anybody else), that’s how he cut his TV teeth. X-Files is one of my all time fav shows, and every week I wouldn’t miss it in its prime, so no wonder I loved BB. Plus, it didn’t hurt that IMO Scully was just an automatic boner, especially from about season 2 onwards…
http://heisenbergchronicles.tumblr.com/post/37809860204/filming-on-location-today-in-abq-better-call-saul
I don’t yet have wi-fi at my new apartment, so last night I slipped a DVD into my laptop: the 2010 WS. It made for some mirth and warmth on a cold winter night. The names and personalities came flooding back: Huff, Burrell, Uribe, Renteria, Wilson, Sanchez, Sanchez, Ross, Schierholtz, Torres, Ishikawa, to name some but not all. Band of misfits. Molina. (He was so moved by the reception he got at AT&T for Game 1.)
DVDs are our friend for sure! My mom practically lives with the 2012 WS in her DVD player!!
On paper? Hey, paper beats rock and since the Dodgers aren’t allowed to run with scissors, we are good to go.
I think Franco Harris was pretty much just a back-up to Lydell Mitchell at Penn State…
Fangraphs had a piece rating the offenses and pitching a week or so ago. I’ll try to find it but they rated our offense as best in the NL West and our pitching as the second worst in all of baseball.
Both ratings surprise me…
I’m trying to find the one I cited, It was a link from someone on Pav’s blog.
They are in line with last year’s stats. As I’ve mentioned once or twice, the Giants’ park-adjusted OPS was second in the NL behind St Louis and the Dodgers, and their park adjusted ERA was the worst in MLB.
http://www.fangraphs.com/depthcharts.aspx?position=Team
Look at “Bat”-that’s RAR
Then look at SP and RP- Starting pitching and Relief pitching.
I’m not sure I’m buying this either-second worst pitching in all of baseball
minus 0.2 relief pitching?
RP worse than the Mets? Uh huh, moving on….
The RP was a real puzzler to me, too.
I’d like to see a stat for playoff teams that shows the percentage of the 25 man roster that was changed from opening day to the final playoff roster. That would tell me how seriously to take a lot of these pre-season projections.
I just find it interesting. There are several more to come. Then I like to see if there is a consensus and/or there are wildly differing projections.
Home run and malaprop king, Ralph Kiner has died at 91…
Sad. Right?
Yeah, he led a sorry existence.
http://nydn.us/1b66q9G
Great link Loo…Really enjoyed it. The rendition of Summer Wind was nice too.
I’ll always remember patiently watching Kiner’s Korner just to get the out-of-town scores at the end. And the malaprops:
“All of his saves have come in relief appearances.”
I remember Kiner, but mostly from the stories from Bob Prince. I hadn’t been to a baseball game yet when he left the Bucs.The Pirates had Kiner, then Frank Thomas,, then Skinner. Pretty good succession of LFers, huh?
“The RP was a real puzzler to me, too.”
It looks like the pitching depth chart basically adjusts the starters upward a bit and the relievers down based on 2013 FIP (starters supposedly pitched a little better than their ERAs, relievers worse), and modest improvement in the rotation. The bullpen is basically the same crew.
The overall bullpen numbers across MLB are interesting, if a little unsurprising. Of the 525 players who put in relief appearances, only 38 of them have a WAR above 1.0. Of the 216 with at least 30 IPs, over half have WARs under .5.