A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball

Quietly Waiting

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on January 3, 2017

It might not get any slower at The Flap than just after New Year’s. The weather sucks. So does football. And I’m not sure but I think freaking hockey is going on right now. Aren’t they about due for another strike?

Retro Stix posts have been retired. I think Loo has gone into his usual winter hibernation. Nothing left but the ghost of haiku’s past whistling outside my darkened window.

Who’s gonna play left field? I think that’s pretty well decided. And I’m not even against the platoon of Mac/Park. I don’t think Bochy has enough hair left on his fivehead to tolerate watching 4 at bats out of one of those dudes day in and day out. But if he matches them up, goes with the hot bat, insert another Bochy cliche, he could probably get through the year watching a split contribution from them.

Of the other guys under contract or invited to ST I think Ruggiano has the best chance to surprise. But I don’t think we have anyone on the roster who’s old enough or built to play every day in left field.

Hey, what’s Angel Pagan up to these days?


58 Responses

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  1. gianthead said, on January 3, 2017 at 6:25 am

    What, the swearing in of the new Congress doesn’t jazz you up Flav????

    I have been so out of it, I just learned last night we signed Morse to a minor league deal…I agree that Rugiano has the best chance to beat out one of the Mac Park’s for a final spot. I think Gorkys is an automatic because of defense…

    • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 6:47 am

      What’s your nap schedule look like in the winter time?

      • willedav said, on January 3, 2017 at 7:51 am

        lulz. I’ll give GH credit tho—as big as his family is, any nap time would be blessed relief I’m sure.

      • gianthead said, on January 3, 2017 at 2:32 pm

        Winter is made for hibernating…I’m not coming out till I don’t see my shadow!!!

      • gianthead said, on January 3, 2017 at 2:40 pm

        Of course the kids all went back to school today after basically two weeks off. The entire two weeks I did not get one damn nap but will say that day after Xmas with this brood and dealing with the in-laws (I think I wrote here that mother in law made me turn off the Dubs game at the start of the 4th)…I don’t think I left the couch for that entire Monday!!! Watched some old great movies like The Thin Man…did get one decent weather day for at least 9 holes. San Dog, my back is messed up again so only got 9 holes in and since I don’t want to lose to the kid, I played from the whites…been working on a new swing with the driver and still hit and miss. Shot an acceptable 47 for me…

  2. willedav said, on January 3, 2017 at 8:00 am

    Hey if I heard right last night during Warrior game, Kings have jumped into 8 spot in the West. That’s something I’ll keep an eye on…1 vs. 8…hmmnn.

    As for Giants, really there doesn’t seem to be much drama over roster spots except end of bench and of course what happens with Cain. If he has a roster spot that might affect who stays/goes in pen. Otherwise Giants seem pretty set:
    Posey Brown
    Belt Panik Craw Nunez Specs Gameface
    Pence Span Mac Parker Gorkys or Ruggiano/scrub OF of choice
    That’s 13 with 12 pitchers.

    5 SPs plus: Gomer FLR Kontos Strick Osich Blach and 1 or more if Cain isn’t in there somewhere

  3. Bozo said, on January 3, 2017 at 8:09 am

    Ah yes, the 25 man roster roulette game. Assuming the Giants go with 13 pitchers you have LF and 4 bench spots (Brown or another backup catcher get’s the 5th bench spot).
    OF – Ruggiano is an interesting signing because he could play all OF positions and with a descent ST could get the LF job or the 4th OFer spot. Once again, the option status of Mac, Parker and Gorky could factor in to that call.
    INF- I hope the Giants realize, that with Nunez they don’t need OOO to backup SS, keep Gillaspie to backup 3B and Specs for 2B.

    Looking forward to see if Wynton Bernard gets much of a look in ST this year, no power but he’s a speed guy that might be fun to watch.

  4. blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 9:02 am

    This is annoying, but out there . . . http://www.fishstripes.com/2017/1/2/14135202/nl-west-notes-giants-long-for-dozier

    Probably more “fake news.” If Dozier does come here, that means a few things: 1. Nunez becomes the “super sub” ala Zobrist in Chicago filling in for most infield and outfield positions when regulars can’t play; 2. Dozier plays 3rd base; and, 3. Mac/Parker platoon continues in left, with Nunez getting some starts, along with Specs and Gorkys.

    • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 9:06 am

      I just skimmed this but what are they supposing we give up? Panik+?

      • blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 9:14 am

        No. Actually Panik would stay (believe it or not). Other articles I have read suggest that the Giants have the minor league wherewithal to make this deal. Here is a Grant Brisbee article which touches on it, albeit, his focus is on Nunie being a disaster in the outfield, should Dozier come here.


      • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 9:47 am

        Doesn’t make much sense to me if we are keeping Panik. Nunie needs to play and to bat leadoff, Doz is probably better suited down the LU anyway. I’d be down with a Panik and Blackburn for Doz but I don’t think that gets it done.

    • willedav said, on January 3, 2017 at 9:46 am

      Nunez is a weak link imo and not someone deserving of 500 ABs. He’s never been a good defender at any position tho I can see him improve given more PT at 3b. OF, no. I’m hoping for someone better (Arroyo maybe) to move him to bench as fill in. His numbers last year as a Giant are dead equal to gameface Gillaspie and I think that’s his ceiling.

      He doesn’t have great OB or patience at the plate, so lead off is out. There are flashes of brilliance, like 2 triples in same game and he runs well, but overall he’s just underwhelming to me.

      • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 9:48 am

        well, we differ greatly on this topic. You don’t think he’s a good defender? He made a couple of bad errors last year like everyone. But he was very solid at 3rd for us.

      • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 10:01 am

        but I agree with you on him in the OF– big neg to that.

      • willedav said, on January 3, 2017 at 10:29 am

        I just see entire skill set as strictly average other than speed on bases. He did get a couple CS last year under murky circumstances that might not have been entirely his fault. But as .260 hitter that isn’t patient I think he’s better 6th or 7th than ideal leadoff. Maybe if bochy hits a SP 8th, Nunez at 9 would work for me.

        I realize D numbers very sketchy to evaluate, but over his career he’s pretty spotty.
        He doesn’t do anything especially well–OB, BA, power.
        Hey if Giants can’t find anyone better OK but he just reminds me of Blanco—more you leave him out there, less valuable he becomes. If you want to improve team, get a better player.

  5. alleykat69 said, on January 3, 2017 at 9:30 am

    By the fearless leader of men..Quote of the New Year!!
    You can’t dismiss the owner!
    That a boy Jed!

  6. willedav said, on January 3, 2017 at 10:40 am

    To be fair we all know Bochy isn’t a small ball type of guy. So maybe he isn’t getting best results possible with Nunez. Maybe if he slotted him at leadoff, left him there and gave him 100% green light to run wild, he’d be an offensive catalyst and occasionally pop one out the yard.

    • Bozo said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:43 pm

      I’d like to see Bochy do that, Willie. Nunez only batted leadoff in 11 games for us last year. He did get a couple of jacks and SBs but batted only about .200 and change. Yet, for the whole year batting 1st, his stats look pretty good to me – .77 G ,286 BA, 48 R, 11 2B, 1 3B, 11 HR, 48 RBIs, 26 SB, 5 CS.

  7. unca_chuck said, on January 3, 2017 at 11:00 am

    Nunez may not be the ideal lead off guy, but he’s by far the best we have. Currently.

    Belt almost makes more sense with all the walks he takes. Almost.

    • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 11:21 am

      I think I’d almost prefer Belt to leadoff. My aggravation level would go down drastically. Plus, he could pop one out every now and then. Of course, someone would have to replace him in his spot down the order. That would probably have to be someone not currently on the roster.

      • willedav said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:06 pm

        aggro level, lol Hey I saw column somewhere that said FA hitters next year will look lot like this off season, but Wellington Castillo only has 1 yr deal with O’s.

      • unca_chuck said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:21 pm

        Well, DJ Dozier would fit in but I don’t want to lose Panik.

  8. alleykat69 said, on January 3, 2017 at 11:57 am

    Shit Bochy wouldn’t even Ricky Henderson a green light to steal,so no chance in hell Nunie gets one…

    • blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:19 pm

      Not true AK . . . Most of his San Diego teams stole bases. See Finley, Joyner, Gwynn, Jackson, Henderson – who you mentioned and even fucking Ryan Klesko stole 23 frickin’ bases for him in 2000.

      Here is a typical San Diego team managed by him . . . http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/SDP/1999.shtml

  9. unca_chuck said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:22 pm

    2000 was a loooong time ago.

    • blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:30 pm

      So, you’re saying he has a red/green light for everyone on the Giants? Hilarious. Me? I think him and the team knows that the stolen base will hurt you equally as much as it can help you. Consequently, the team rarely steals. In fact, it’s more of a negative, if you read most articles (supported by stats) which uniformly say that the stolen base is over rated. Where the hell is James? I think he’s on record as saying much the same thing.

      • blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:34 pm

        To wit, stolen bases are not generally valued highly by advanced stats, which suggest that the consequence of an unsuccessful stolen-base attempt – the player is not only knocked off the basepaths but also costs his team an out – typically outweighs the benefits.

  10. willedav said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:36 pm

    Pagan had high of 29 steals in 2012, when he hit .288 38 doubles 15 triples slash line of .338/.440 for .778.
    Sounds way over Nunez head to me.
    That was with Scut hitting second, wow was he great at moving runners over. Loved watching that guy.
    Agree with Blade’s 12:30. Bochy doesn’t run much because he doesn’t have players for it, and I’d say same thing with small ball in general. who on this team can bunt or h/r?

    • blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:46 pm

      Thanks Willie . . . MLB teams today focus on run-scoring probabilities. What is the value of an out versus the value of gaining 90 feet? Numerous statistical studies have shown that the break-even success rate for steals (the rate at which an attempt to steal is neither helping nor hurting the team in terms of total runs scored) is about 70 percent. If you’re not reaching that benchmark, as sabermetricians would suggest, you’re wasting too many outs.

  11. chipower9 said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:41 pm

    Only 41 daze until pitchers and catchers report.

    Play ball, bitches!

  12. snarkk said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:43 pm

    I disagree with those who would trade Panik. 2nd base was a black hole for years, culminating with Uggla’s cuppa coffee. Finally SF has a gold glover who is young that works great in tandem with Craw. I think he was hurt last year, plus that concussion was probably worse than advertised. Give him this season to come back at the plate. Who would take his place?…

    • blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 12:52 pm

      Not really down with Panik, but as you pointed out – who would take his place? OK, with giving him this season to reveal the real Panik. Also, one reason I like the – probably fake news – of Dozier coming here, is that it will likely cost us only minor league prospects and maybe an MLB player (pitcher? Utility player?). Anywho, I am hoping Panik can have something comparable to his rookie season heroics. Wait and see . . .

  13. Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 1:03 pm

    the only reason to trade Panik would be to acquire Doz. And I’m not super hot on that idea for reasons listed before about Doz.
    Regarding the stolen base talk, you obviously need guys stealing who have a high level of success. I would think the stolen base is much more important to a team that can’t hit the ball out of the park than it is to a team who doesn’t have problems doing that.

  14. unca_chuck said, on January 3, 2017 at 1:26 pm

    Blade, stolen bases can help when you aren’t jacking bombs all over the place. It’s simply a matter of getting runners over with less than 2 outs. I’m not saying everyone has the green light but ignoring that aspect of the game with a guy like Nunez who can give you 20-30 SBs is stupid. He’s got a 75% success rate. Not spectacular, but enough to help.

    Especially given the trouble with which this team scored runs last year.

  15. unca_chuck said, on January 3, 2017 at 1:27 pm

    Duuurrr. Didn’t see yer post, Flav….

  16. unca_chuck said, on January 3, 2017 at 1:32 pm

    Panik looks like a hitter. Plain and simple. He won’t be hitting 30 bombs, but he should be able to hit 12-15 and drive in 70-80. Which is fine.

  17. chipower9 said, on January 3, 2017 at 1:57 pm

    I am with the crowd who is a no on trading Panik. I think this guy will win several gold gloves before it is all said and done, and I also see him as possibly winning a batting title. Agree – give him this year to see how he performs. He is a damned fine ballplayer and costs almost nothing right now.

  18. alleykat69 said, on January 3, 2017 at 2:08 pm

    Yep and you don’t breakup a GG infield(excluding 3rd) which includes Belt who should of won one last year imo.

  19. sandog said, on January 3, 2017 at 2:27 pm

    I’m totally down with packaging Panik for Dozier. I think Dozier is a better player and I think swapping a lefty bat for a righty bat is always a great move in our ballpark. If I were the Yankees, I’d have Panik on my radar. He likes to hit the ball in the air and in their ballpark, he could be a 30/100 guy. No way in hell at ATT.
    As for Crazy Horse Pagan, having him on the team has been a wild ride. I was a huge fan of his at one point and still feel like he overall has been a solid player for us. Having said that, I’m ready to cut ties with him and wouldn’t even be on board with bringing him back on a cheap one year deal. EIther bring in a legit RH power bat to play LF or give the job to Mac/Parker. As I think Flav mentioned earlier, I don’t care how Bochy wants to work the platoon—straight righty/lefty or ride whoever seems to be swinging the bat well. All I ask is he lets those 2 have the position without some Blanco/Pagan/Reggiano type guy getting thrown in there regularly.

    • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 6:04 pm

      yes. there is something to be said for swapping out a lefty with limited power for a righty who has power, especially in our yard. Great point.

  20. zumiee said, on January 3, 2017 at 2:58 pm

    It was fun watching the ’12 and ’14 World Series highlight films on MLB Network this past weekend. Instantly got my bask back on. The films, of course, have highlights of the seasons and playoffs, too. Too bad they didn’t show the ’10 film. The network was just showing the ’11-’16 films.
    The NL has won 5 of the last 7 World Series, which is very cool.

  21. blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 3:08 pm

    A very cool letter from Mark Melancon.* His story about Hunter joining him for a session of Hot Yoga is hilarious. I am going to have to subscribe to this website . . . http://www.theplayerstribune.com/mark-melancon-san-francisco-giants/

    * I didn’t much care for this signing, but Melancon won my heart in this letter to the fans, so I’m down with him being part of our team and hope he can produce. Seems like a stand up guy.

    • unca_chuck said, on January 3, 2017 at 3:32 pm

      As long as he doesn’t start making chick videos . . .

    • alleykat69 said, on January 3, 2017 at 3:50 pm

      Thanks for finding the article Blade!
      Real good read,I wasn’t originally into landing Melancon as much as Jansen for sure, but his attitude of respect for the organization and his “I really want to play here”,similar to Shark last year should only prove to be a positive going forward!Now just go out a get me my 45 saves and life is good Mark..

      • blade3colorado said, on January 3, 2017 at 4:14 pm

        De nada AK . . . Hey, you might have read this already, since it has been out awhile. It’s about Brandon Crawford’s call up to the bigs (in his own words). Awesome long read and that alone has me fired up for the season to start right now.


      • zumiee said, on January 3, 2017 at 5:14 pm

        “I literally have a lifetime of Giants memories”
        Very cool article. Thanks!

    • zumiee said, on January 3, 2017 at 5:18 pm

      He’s a little oldish (29), so I don’t know if the Giants are all that serious.
      Maybe the Giants will swoop in at the last minute and go for one of the power hitting free agents out there.

      • zumiee said, on January 3, 2017 at 5:22 pm

  22. mrsprtdude said, on January 3, 2017 at 6:10 pm

    RE SB’s…I know the stats guys would argue this…But a guy who hits 50 doubles and hits .250 is the same guy who hits 10 doubles if he steals 50 and gets caught 10 times except he is a fast guy who scores from 2nd on a single ( which 2/3rds of our team cant do), advances or scores on a flyball ( again 2/3rds can’t) and puts pressure on the defense…Plus much more fun to watch. imo a fast guy should try to steal EVERY time he is on 1st base….

    • Flavor said, on January 3, 2017 at 6:20 pm

      every time? haha, well I would definitely pay more interest to the game when that guy gets on first base.

      • djloo27 said, on January 3, 2017 at 8:03 pm

        Nothing more exciting than a dozen or so “pick off” lobs to first to hold the runner close…

      • Flavor said, on January 4, 2017 at 4:16 am

        yeah. But he’s going EVERY TIME, lol. So at some point, shit gonna get real.

  23. zumiee said, on January 3, 2017 at 7:03 pm

    Derek Law got married this week.

    • djloo27 said, on January 3, 2017 at 8:19 pm

      At some point they’ll probably discover that this was the moment he tore his rotator cuff…

  24. Macdog said, on January 3, 2017 at 7:11 pm

    Rajai Davis back with the A’s.

  25. djloo27 said, on January 3, 2017 at 8:11 pm

    Me and San Dawg still have some football business to attend to with our Chiefs. They’ll probably have to knock off Pittsburgh in KC then head for New England. The main reason the Pats don’t scare me is because I can only name 4 of them…

    • Flavor said, on January 4, 2017 at 4:27 am

      I’m absolutely rooting for the Chiefs. Alex Smith caught way too much shit here and with the franchise in ruins it’s nice to see him still chugging along. A Super Bowl win for him would be fantastic.

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