A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball

Dreaming Of Someone Else’s Dudes

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on March 19, 2018

If that headline doesn’t grab you, come on…..

With Daniel checking in today (hopefully) I was going to ask a tricky question like “If you could trade the Giants org for the Cardinals org, straight up, would you do it?” But there’s an obvious answer there. Not that the masses at AT&T would get it right. Our season ticket holders are in love with the names of the players they know and the merchandise they buy. Baer has brilliantly marketed the team to the fans, especially the female fans. And that’s largely why we are stuck with so many aging players with fat dollars coming there way in the next few/several seasons…..

But would hardcore Flappers trade our team straight up with St. Louis? I’m not sure if we could find one who wouldn’t. They have better mlb players who are far more position flexible than our guys. And their farm system is always better. I can almost sign off on them having a better manager at this point. Not because I like Matheny I just think Bochy is done-zo, man.

So I’ll ask it this way: Is there anyone out there who WOULDN’T trade our org for their org straight up?

And for Daniel, is there a current Giants position player you would want over one you already have? Maybe Longoria over Gyorko?

74 Responses

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  1. Cardinal70 said, on March 19, 2018 at 6:03 am

    First off, hello guys! Looking forward to hanging out here some today. Hit me up with any Cardinal questions you might have.

    As for Craig’s query, that’s a very tough question. There were rumors this offseason about the Cardinals getting Longoria as part of a bigger package, but I think Gyorko has been pretty solid for us. If I had to choose one spot, that’d probably be it.

    I mean, if you could take emotion and history out of the equation and purely look at it logically for years to come, I guess you’d look at Posey over Molina. However, Molina’s going to be a Cardinal Hall of Famer (not necessarily Cooperstown, mind you, but the version of it they have across from the ballpark) and they signed him to a three-year extension that just starts this year to make sure he wouldn’t go anywhere else. You can’t argue with that, as much as Carson Kelly might like to.

  2. zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 6:43 am

    I’m not for doing that kind of trade. Maybe it’s a pipe dream hoping so many Giants have bounce-back seasons, but what the heck. I like when sports is more than just rooting for the laundary they’re wearing.

    • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 6:48 am

      How about Zito in the ’12 playoffs? There’s no logical reason for that to have happened. Yet it’s something we will never stop being amazed by. It makes us feel something bigger than sports.

  3. zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 6:56 am

    Question for Daniel: does the NL Central title seem attainable, or is ’18 pretty much a quest for the Wild Card, for the Cards?
    The Cubs added Darvish, but the Cubs did seem vulnerable last season.

    • Cardinal70 said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:04 am

      Do I expect the Cards to take the division? Not really. The Cubs are still pretty good. But I do think it is attainable. I was talking last night on one of my many podcasts and I feel like this could be a 90 win team with perhaps, if absolutely everything goes right, a little more. If Darvish looks like he did in the World Series, if Lester continues to age, if there’s a notable injury, the Cardinals could be right there.

      I think the NL Central race will be pretty interesting with not only the Cardinals but the Brewers in serious pursuit. Now, Chicago won’t be dealing with that Series hangover and they could come out roaring. And they are still the team to pick. But it’s not a slam dunk.

  4. zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:00 am

    If the division titles go Nats, Cubs, and Dodgers, then the remainders are in a fierce fight for the Wild Cards. Brewers, Cards, D-Backs, Rockies, maybe the Mets…..maybe the Giants. 🙂

    • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:02 am

      The Phillies and Padres could be interesting young upstarts.

    • Cardinal70 said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:06 am

      There definitely seems to be some dividing lines between a group of teams that should win the division, a group of teams that are probably all within a few games of the wild card, and then a group of teams that are already out of it.

      • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:44 am

        For the Giants, they have the immediate challenge of trying to survive a tough April schedule. They need to hang as close to .500 as they can in that month.

  5. willedav said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:19 am

    Is Carpenter healthy? Where does he play defensively, and what type of season would you project for him?
    Lot of changes to bullpen over last coupe years…who do you like, and are you OK with how Matheny handles it?

    • Cardinal70 said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:31 am

      Carpenter appears to be healthy. They sat him the first half of spring in an abundance of caution (apparently) given that he was having some back stiffness. He’s like 3-5 with a homer and two or three walks in the games since he started playing and did some third and second yesterday. I was concerned earlier but it looks like he’ll be good to go for the opening bell.

      Carp was quoted as he “sold his soul for home runs” in the past and he’s going to try to get back to being that line drive hitter he has been. He hated hitting .240 last season even though he still was valuable. If that’s the case, he’s probably going to hit around .270-.280 with more like 10-12 homers and get on base at a .360 or so clip. Which should work out well hitting third with speed/power/OBP guys in front of him and a thumper like Ozuna behind him.

      I really like what I’ve seen out of the bullpen so far. The ERAs are low but you could factor that as being part of the ballpark, etc. What I like more is the fact that most of these arms are limiting hits and piling up the strikeouts. Even going with a 13 man staff (which Matheny always goes with, even when in the past arms have sat out there rotting) there are going to be a couple of quality arms in Memphis that the team can rotate through during the year. Given that most of the starters are rarely going to go past the sixth, having that kind of bullpen depth is huge. And that’s not even factoring in Alex Reyes when he returns in May.

      Matheny has flaws and bullpen usage has definitely been one of them. Our hope as fans is that Mike Maddux will fix some of those tenancies. The Cardinals talked about him having more say than an average pitching coach in decisions. If he can help Matheny make the right choice more regularly, he’ll have earned that reputation.

  6. Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:52 am

    I’m surprised my comment about our bullpen didn’t get questioned more by Flappers. I don’t feel super strong about it being a strength this year but I do think, for the reasons I gave, that it could be a positive surprise this year. And we will desperately need it….

    • willedav said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:03 am

      bullpens are a crapshoot for a lot of teams, even contenders. There aren’t many Jansens out there, and every team needs multiple set up guys to get to the closer. Lot of moving parts that can be wildly inconsistent—Cubs being exhibit A.
      I think Giants pen with addition of Watson can be very serviceable…more concerned with SPs and Cueto as you brought up. He dominates and the others hold down runs allowed to reasonable number, Giants could be in it.

      • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:10 am

        In the World Series, the Astros basically gave up on their bullpen, and used other starting pitchers as main bullpen pieces.

  7. willedav said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:09 am

    While of course everyone would have loved to have Stanton, the MVP of ex-Marlins unloaded this off season to me is Ozuna. Man that was a great get for Cards and guy I really wanted to see in Giants uni.
    He reminds me of golden days of great SF OFs in the organization and is just type of dynamic multiple tool player Giants haven’t had in years.

    • Cardinal70 said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:21 am

      I sincerely hope so. He started slow this spring but there’s got to be a little pressure to go to a new team after being in the Marlins organization his whole career. I hope his breakout last year will continue and the Cards will have that thump they’ve been missing.

  8. willedav said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:22 am

    One last ? for Daniel. And really appreciate you coming over here, including Craig in your Pepper format.

    IF, Cards were right behind Cubs and challenging for Division/WC is there an area you think that might be of concern where you’d be after the FO to add in player at deadline?

    • Cardinal70 said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:30 am

      Hey, I’ll be checking all day long so this definitely doesn’t have to be the last question! 🙂

      This is a good one. The Cardinals seem to be good at most every position, even if they aren’t great. So it may take going into the season to see what kind of weakness is exposed. Initially, I’d say if Adam Wainwright shows his age, they might want a starter, but they have Jack Flaherty waiting in the wings and he looks really good. I feel like the bullpen shouldn’t be much of a problem, but that can always be supplemented.

      If Toronto falls out of things the calls for Josh Donaldson are going to return. Which probably would be an upgrade over Gyorko and something I would do, but I don’t know that it’d be extremely necessary.

  9. dirtnrocksnomo said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:17 am

    I just don’t watch enough of other teams (esp in the spring) to have an opinion on swapping orgs. Stratton and Blach both shelled on Saturday. Sure, it’s still spring but between those 2 and Samardzija “not being where he wants to be”, the SP is the main concern which can snowball into the BP.

    Sweet 16 is pretty cool for UNR. Other than the dregs of society trolling the seedy downtown and skanks at the Gentleman’s Club, one thing that stood out to me when I lived there was the small town community feeling/embrace of the Wolf Pack.

    • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:24 am

      Stratton is probably the starting pitcher for the Giants on the Sunday night ESPN game vs. the Dodgers in the opening series. Anybody feeling good about that?

    • Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:30 am

      that’s a great call. And I got to see it with my own eyes on Fri. Big time Wolfpack pride. Not just gambling on them, the locals really seemed to connect to what they were trying to do. Rare to see people in Reno care about something other than gambling, at least the places I hang out…..

  10. snarkk said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:44 am

    At this point in ST, like I said the other day, my concern in the pitching staff. Bum and Cueto look good. After that, meh. And the better hitting we assume will come may not be able to offset that. On radio the other day, Kruk said Affeldt said Melancon had a “GREAT bullpen” session. Hearsay hype — that makes me feel much better…

  11. blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 10:02 am

    If we’re talking swapping organizations – no way, no how. Just our ownership group overwhelms their’s, i.e., a mid-market team (correct me if I am wrong Daniel). In fact, I think our ownership group is the richest in baseball and that includes the Yankees and Dodger organizations.

    Add our beautiful ball park and the positive changes we made in our minor leagues; demoting Evans and elevating Sabes; and the various coaching changes – I’ll take our organization every day and twice on Sunday.

    The only gripe I have are our players and their contracts. The players are “long in the tooth” for ball players and their contracts are going to bite us in the ass . . . if not this season, then in the future.

    • Cardinal70 said, on March 19, 2018 at 10:14 am

      The Cardinals often play in the market like they are a mid-market team. Of course, in comparison to most markets St. Louis would be considered small but when you factor in the reach of the club, from Arkansas (where I am) to Iowa to Oklahoma, it covers more ground than many other small markets do.

      Of course, they’ve got a billion dollar TV deal that kicks in this year (plus some ownership percentage of FOX Sports Midwest), Ballpark Village across the street from the park which–while there is debt service to cover there since the ownership is doing that on their own dime for the most part–is often packed and the rents and money they make there has to be notable. Enough that they are setting up Phase II with a hotel and the like.

      I think the money really is there. The problem with the front office is 1) they are used to making more out of less, 2) I think they like to be thought of as a smart organization and smart organizations–in their mind–don’t get stuck with albatross contracts (though they really were just lucky the Angels outbid them for Pujols), and 3) they really like their young developing players. Some of that is financial, of course, but some of that is they’ve done a real good job of development over the past two decades.

      If you told me next year they outbid everyone on Manny Machado, I would be a little surprised but I would also believe it to be completely possible. Of course, I expected them to spend money this offseason and I guess they would have if Stanton would have been more amenable to the middle of the country.

  12. Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 12:31 pm

    • dirtnrocksnomo said, on March 19, 2018 at 12:40 pm

      Just in time for Williams-Sonoma’s spring sale. Allie will be pleased.

  13. alleykat69 said, on March 19, 2018 at 1:18 pm

    Allie will realize someday love only goes so far when your washing his jockstrap all the time..

  14. gianthead said, on March 19, 2018 at 1:27 pm

    I am going no just based on one player…Bum!! I want hin retiring as a Giant Hall of Famer…

  15. YogiBarrister (@Yogi47951368) said, on March 19, 2018 at 1:41 pm

    Two deal breakers for me: If we had to trade ballparks too and give up Heliot Ramos.
    Seriously though, BF is admitting he roots for the uniform and the Cardinals have one of the top three coolest uniforms in all of sports. (Yankees, Blackhawks).
    I would trade the Giants front office for theirs. Other than Ramos, I have no attachment to any of our minor league players, would make that trade. I wouldn’t trade our 25 man roster, our announcers, Tony Bennett, or even Amy G..
    Full disclosure: I’m not a dyed-in-the-wool-uniform Giants fan, I have two NY teams I can fall back on. I’m more interested winning division titles than World Series, and love baseball for the seasons in which it’s played. I would trade for St Louis evenings (never the days), as long as it’s not raining.

  16. Macdog said, on March 19, 2018 at 2:38 pm

    Roster news:

    Tyler Beede, Derek Law, Mac Williamson, Roberto Gomez and Austin Slater optioned to Triple-A.

    Andrew Suarez, Joan Gregorio, Jose Valdez, Justin O’Connor, Trevor Brown, Hector Sanchez, Orlando Calixte, Chase d’Arnaud, Kyle Jensen and Chris Shaw all reassigned.

    • blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:05 pm

      No real surprises (except maybe Williamson) . . . Duggar, Hernandez, Blanco and Parker competing for two outifeld slots.

  17. blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:10 pm

    Cueto stunk up the joint today – 7 hits, 4 runs, 2 BBs, 2 bombs, and 4 SOs in 4.1 innings.

    • blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:13 pm

      Watson didn’t look too hot either (3 hits, 1 earned run, 1 inning pitched).

    • Macdog said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:24 pm

      In glass-half-full outlook, Giants scored 3 runs off Tomlin.

  18. dirtnrocksnomo said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:14 pm

    Parker (who sucks) survived cuts today and hit a bomb.

    • blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:24 pm

      Yeah, saw that . . . But I agree – he sucks and has continued to suck this spring (despite today’s bomb). Conversely, Williamson has looked pretty good this spring. He’s also trying a new stance/swing; and, during the off season worked with the hitting coach from LA, who “remade” Justin Turner’s swing/career. Last, but not least, Williamson is only 27 versus Parker’s 29.

      • dirtnrocksnomo said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:27 pm

        Parker (who sucks) isn’t an elite defender, is over matched by MLB pitching and hits LH. There’s no reason to keep carrying him.

    • blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:29 pm

      Which makes this sentence today from Schulman (after the cuts) regarding Bochy even more mystifying . . .

      “Also, manager Bruce Bochy hinted the club might go with athleticism over power for the backup outfield spots given the age of the starting outfield.”


  19. alleykat69 said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:29 pm

    I will not be thrilled if the Gorkster&Blanco both make the team but that’s what it’s looking like meh..

  20. wilcojoe said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:34 pm

    Correct me if I am wrong but I don’t think Flavor is including the ballpark when he discusses a possible swap. I am not even sure he is including the ownership team. Assuming he is not including either, yeah I take the Cards players and front office. I want the front office that has produced one of the the top minor league systems for the last decade. They also groomed the GM of the reigning WS Champions, Jeff Luhnow.

    • Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 4:23 pm

      Thanks. Yeah, just the manager, coaches, GM and all the players (mlb and farm)

  21. blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:36 pm

    Is Longoria injured? I haven’t seen him play in a few games (or at least, I don’t recall him being in the lineup).

  22. blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:38 pm

    Trevor is looking good defensively.

  23. wilcojoe said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:39 pm

    If it includes the broadcast teams, I might change my mind. I couldn’t handle Joe Buck and Jon Miller is the best in the business and god willing, should be good for another 10-15 years. However I would trade Amy G for their sideline reporter, sight unseen.

    • blade3colorado said, on March 19, 2018 at 3:45 pm

      Umm . . . You sure? I think it’s one of these GUYS:

      Jim “The Cat” Hayes – Cardinals Reporter
      Scott Warmann – Cardinals Reporter

      Please clarify Daniel. lol

  24. alleykat69 said, on March 19, 2018 at 5:58 pm

    BF are you sure you haven’t suffered a few Matheny concussions?
    Bochy schooled him in the playoffs just sayin..

  25. zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 6:56 pm

    The Warriors jerseys tonight have a cool psychedelic logo on the front.

  26. Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:16 pm

    so sad to see Dwight like this….

  27. zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:36 pm

    Turner hit on the wrist by a pitch. He dives over the plate.

    • djloo27 said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:12 pm

      Was he wearing his faggety little pink wedding slippers?

  28. djloo27 said, on March 19, 2018 at 7:58 pm

    My new favorite thing here is Parker (who sucks)…

    • Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:00 pm

      lol! Dirt has been on fire the last few days, eh?

      • djloo27 said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:04 pm


  29. djloo27 said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:03 pm

    What kind of odds would you have to get to bet that the Giants have 4 players hit 20 homers this season?
    How about on 5 players?

    • Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:06 pm

      i’d bet 4 at 25-1. 5? 60-1

      • djloo27 said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:19 pm

        I’d jump on that 25-1. Even the 76 win 2006 geezer brigade had 4…

  30. Flavor said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:05 pm

    um…wait what?

    • djloo27 said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:14 pm

      He was once a new born baby. Amazing how people’s lives turn out…

  31. PaulinAsia Banh Bao said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:40 pm

    Testing… been having probs logging in since moving up to Hanoi, who knows why….

  32. PaulinAsia Banh Bao said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:41 pm

    Cool, nevermind… 🙂

  33. zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 8:54 pm

    Turner got hit 19 times last season by pitches.

  34. zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:00 pm

    Somebody already YouTubed it. That was quick.

  35. Macdog said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:25 pm

    • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:31 pm

      Looked very similar to the Pence injury. And Pence has arguably never been the same since that injury.

      • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:31 pm

        Age, of course, a factor, too.

      • Macdog said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:34 pm

        I thought the same thing.

    • snarkk said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:46 pm

      That ball wasn’t THAT far inside. Turner went forward into the ball with his leg kick, didn’t back off it, that’s probably why he got the injury…

  36. snarkk said, on March 19, 2018 at 9:51 pm

    Parker looks like he’ll make the team only due to lack of options. I give him a max of a month up on the 25, or they try to trade him for something before the season starts. He should go to a dogmeat club that can handle a dude that will hit an HR every 15 ABs, and will strike out 6-7 times during those 15 ABs…

    • zumiee said, on March 19, 2018 at 10:00 pm

      And as Dirt mentioned, Parker’s not good defensively.

    • djloo27 said, on March 20, 2018 at 5:14 am

      I have a hunch that Parker (who sucks) will be dealt to a team that plays in a very left friendly park…

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