A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball

Not really sure what the Mets are doing but we needed a new thread so we can kick it around here if you’re interested. New York gets an aging second baseman on the downside of his career without his steroids and a top of the line closer. I’m not understanding this. Closers are a dime a dozen and they turn sour quicker than you can get “M-a-r-k M-e-l-a-n-c-o-n” out of your mouth.

This new GM is looking to make a big splash but outside of the closer what are they getting? And taking on Cano? And losing prospects? This looks like a terrible deal for the Mets…..

WillieD had an interesting thought at the end of the last thread and since it’s a slow time for baseball let’s dig a little deeper into it:

Given the general opinion in the F/G column bum’s skill set is definitely in decline, doesn’t that make hanging onto him until the deadline more likely to lessen his value than increase it? I think contending teams that want pitching are going after it right now and he is very reasonable for at least 2019.”

The first thing to remember about *decline* is that it doesn’t usually look like this:

True, if his production were to look like this he would be most valuable right now and should be traded for whatever the Giants can get. But I think it’s pretty well accepted that even NOW he would only bring back one elite prospect.

Bum’s decline doesn’t have to be absolute. The fangraph’s article is looking at more of his career in decline, not individual games in the future. It’s certainly reasonable to expect that we will see the strongest Bum to start the 2019 season that we’ve seen in years. He’s got 2 consecutive seasons of limited innings on his arm not to mention he’s probably working out like a fiend trying to prove his doubters wrong. If he has a bounce first half, maybe even a dominant first half, but the team flounders, then his value will be much higher than right now and probably at it’s peak for the remainder of his career. Factoring in the desperation level of a team will be UP at the break and not the off season, maybe we get more than one elite prospect next July if everything falls into place.

It’s a risk but I’d hold on to him and hope for a first half bounce back instead of trading him right now…..

….for one pitching prospect? Why do that? I think Flappers have this one correct: it would be pointless to trade him for one pitching prospect and if they are going to trade him they should do it when his value is at its highest. There’s certainly no guarantee that he’ll have a solid, Bum-like first half next year but if he does THAT’S when you trade him. Nobody is paying up for him right now. Even then, he’d be a rental with only a couple of months left on his deal. Still, if he was dominant maybe someone would give up 2 studs and a fringe prospect for him in that scenario.

But I have seen the light, I’m not expecting much. At this point in his career nobody cares about when he did in October NEARLY 5 years ago. With his peripherals trending the wrong way he’s more valuable to us than anyone else. Disappointing, I know…

Giants might as well be in hibernation right now. There seems to be nothing pending and when a guy like Nate Eovaldi is one of the hottest starting pitchers on the free agent market it’s hard to ratchet up any interest in the hot stove season.

The Niners continue their impressive steamroll towards the number 1 pick in the draft. So I guess there’s that. But there really are some NFL teams that are worth paying to watch these days: The Rams, Saints and Chiefs would get my money and even the Chargers, Bears and the Andrew Luck led Colts are exciting to watch. College football is kind of a mess but all that should get sorted out in time for the bowl games—the games we have to wait a month to watch. That’s dumb by the way.

Not sure if hockey is going on, maybe it’s over I dunno.

Morning thought: Nobody claps their hands together harder than the group who greets the opening bell at the NYSE….

Reuben Foster is without question the dumbest motherfucker to ever play for the 49ers. He’s dumber than Aldon Smith. He’s dumber than a bag of rocks. The fact that he’d speak a single word ever again to this loopy chick who accused him of abuse and then recanted her accusation is mind blowing. You are a goddamn professional football player, man! You have money, fame, basically everything you could want in life. For the love of god, date a different girl!!!!!! ANY GIRL!!!!!!!

John Lynch looks awful in all of this. He has repeatedly chosen to back this idiot and I firmly believe the only reason he released him this morning was because he really wasn’t having a very good season and it was easier to release him than stand up their like a dolt and back him again.

Character matters in everything you do. It just does. Nothing is worth surrounding yourself or your team with dumbasses. Sure, you can win it all with guys like Foster on your team but you can also win it all with players who have a moral compass and players who aren’t complete idiots.

One of the firmest lessons I learned a long time ago and one of the simplest keys to success in life is this: Don’t surround yourself with idiots. If you are surrounded by idiots get new friends/coworkers/etc. Your life with get exponentially better if you do this.

That link Snarkk posted at the end of yesterday’s thread was disappointing but not surprising. I’m guessing having a shithead racist team owner puts you in the majority. It does make you wonder though, what would Johnson have to do before he was pressured to sell the team? You would think that in San Francisco the bar would be low but the calls for him to sell are sparse at best.

College football couldn’t get any bigger today. I’ll take Ohio State just because it’s ingrained in me to expect Harbs to lose the big one although man, Michigan sure looks good right now.

Is that still a thing? Do people still go out to the stores like maniacs? There is no amount of money or any threat you could issue that would prod me into going into a store today to fucking shop.

What is Zaidi doing? I’m ready for some action.

This is gold. Eat something good today.

A few years ago we’d talk about being thankful for those 3 beauties but I don’t hear much talk about those these days. Man, imagine being a Dodger fan and trying to remember that beauty from THIRTY freaking years ago. Most of the people that were there for that one are dead now or not born yet.

Still, as long ago as 2014 seems, I’ll never get tired of those flags flying true at good ol’ AT&T Park. Sometimes it feels like we paid quite a price for them though.

Have fun this week whatever you choose to do and wherever you choose to go. If all you’re doing is walkin’ the earth, be thankful for that, too…..

The weirdest part of this week: no wind at all. Not even a breath of wind. The smoke just came here and sat down on us. Another fire stirred up in Boulder Creek yesterday but I wasn’t worried about it. No way for it to move anywhere with no wind. There’s talk of rain next Wednesday but I’ll believe it when I see it….

With my Big Game plans torpedoed there isn’t much going on in the sports world around here. Dubs trying to rebound from that pathetic effort in Houston. They just aren’t the same without Curry on the floor.

Note to trolls who have nothing else to do with their lives except haunt a Giants blog: You can post here but you need to be creative. If you just post the same bland, boring stuff I’m banning you. I’m basically saying “Don’t be stupid.” If that’s too much of a challenge maybe it’s best if you stay at home at a Dodgers blog with like-minded fans such as yourself…..

Round these parts, everyone is taking sides. You’re either on Draymond’s side or you’re on Durant’s side. I’m on Getthefuckoverit’s side.

There’s no question that Green is hard to get along with. Bonds and Kent weren’t two picnics you’d like to spend an afternoon with, either. But Draymond did something those two couldn’t do: he has given the Bay multiple flags. So you put up with some stuff. Easy for me to say, I don’t have to work with him.

We’ve been on quite a run here in the Bay Area. 2010, 2012, 2014, 2015, 2017, 2018….Before 2010 we were just a bunch of dopes wandering around the wilderness. And you know what? We liked it. I watched Mets and Rays fans on twitter deliriously celebrating their Cy Young wins. Pffftttttt…..boring. I can’t go back to that shit. I’m a Pavlovian dog that only salivates when he hears a downtown parade a ‘comin.

The bottom line is that athletes play for money. We love them as long as they win. I’ve had some bad relationships in my life that were healthier than that. I don’t know what the Warriors are going to do with Draymond, I hope they figure out how to make this work. The only thing I know for sure is that this run is going to end sooner than I want it to. It always does.

Trading or keeping Madison Bumgarner is probably the most interesting topic we’ll kick around this off season. The dazzling idea of scooping up a bounty of prospects for Bum is alluring. But it’s also not realistic. I’ve held on to the dream that teams would want Bumgarner because of his legendary post season success but that’s not how players are evaluated anymore. The nerds with the calculators don’t have a button for “legendary”. They look at the peripherals and those are trending downward. OPS is one of the favorite stats considered here at the Flap. Opponents OPS vs Bum’s fastball has climbed from .619 in 2014 to a whopping .954 last year. Who is gonna pay up for that?

Sadly, I think Bum is worth more to us than anyone else just because fans love him and I can’t see Baer signing off on trading him for one decent pitching prospect–which is probably all we’d get offered.

Whatever, keep him, try to fill out the roster with a gaggle of Muncy’s and see what happens……

OK, BF. After at least a decade, Cal has a shot.
You’re on — in this Bears v Tree “Tilt for the Ages” !
Screw the weenie spread.
It’s mano a mano, baby. Straight up or down. Bears to win outright !

Oh, and define drinks “all night”. I like the Bears, but I ain’t no simpleton; I ain’t talkin’ bottle service at the Bellagio if my Bears turn into widdle cubbles.

BTW, those “Cal” kids that yelled some shit at you — they HAD to be JC wannabes wearing Cal merch. Cal people can be boisterous, but in a very respectful ‘Ol Blue sorta way.
Bring it ON, Pee on the Tree!!!

________________

“Pee on the tree”??????

……Sorry, I’m back. Snarkk’s disrespect of The Tree sent me into a 12 minute blind rage. When I finally snapped out of it I had reduced everything in my living room to rubble. Now just doing a slow burn, I’m able to continue with the thread…..

“Drinks all night” can be translated into “beers for the event” of your choosing. A Giants game would be the most likely common ground for us but another trip to the Pleasanton track next Summer would work or if you’re into March Madness you can join me and San Diggity in Reno next March for a weekend you won’t soon forget. Regardless, the winner can put the “event of beers” in the bank to be cashed in some time in the future.

I’ll assume that qualifies as “bet on”. Down on The Farm we play for keeps, rarely lose, and I’ll cap Saturday’s beat down with a long, satisfying stream of urination that will cascade to the bottom of Tightwad Hill.

Happy Veterans Day. Two flaps up to any vets out there and any and all victims of war. My old man is veteran and I salute you, dad. And this is the first Veterans Day in a long long time without The Twinner…..

Fall is flying by. Thanksgiving is right around the corner. The hot stove season should interest me more but it doesn’t. Even with the big brain on Zaidi crushing everything in its path it’s tough for me to envision any reasonable or interesting ways to fix this team. Besides that, the Giants are just so boring.

One thing I’m looking forward to: The 2018 Big Game. For the first time in years Stanford is going nowhere nationally so they might as well focus up on their next game. Oh, what do you know, it’s Cal; my fourth most despised team after The Dodgers, USC and Notre Dame.  Normally The Cardinal wipe out the Bears like an irritating bug stain on the windshield. I honestly can’t remember the last year Stanford lost. But the game is in Cal this year so they have a fighting chance to cover the spread. I’m smelling a looming bet between me and Snarkk who is awesome in every way except for his *odious* proclivity to supporting *them*.

Somehow Stanford is only favored by 2 over those shady bunko artists. Of course I will lay the points if you feel you need them but a more valid bet would be straight up, yes?

This picture is fantastic. Me and my dad are just off Moen’s left hand. The walk to the car that day was interesting. Scores of Cal fans screaming “Fuck you Stanford!!!” in my 13 year old face. Classy students…..

I’m 200 miles away and yet that distinct smoke smell is everywhere I go. I’ve never been to Paradise, Ca but the last few days I’ve been struck by how many people know people who live up there. Or I should say “lived up there.” It’s just tragic that an entire town can get erased in less than a day.

This is an incredibly sad article:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/california-wildfires/article/This-was-Paradise-How-do-you-quantify-13381061.php

If you look west from my house there’s 280 and the hills behind that. Everything is so dry. It could all go up today. I’ve always wondered why terrorists don’t target an area like this. Billions of dollars of residential real estate. What’s stopping them?

Slow Zone for Bay Area sports right now. No baseball. Niners stink. I don’t know if hockey has started yet nor do I care. Steph’s hurt. California’s burning to the ground.

Bad mood today.

Now I’m thinking Zaidi keeps Bumgarner because the haul he’d pull back really wouldn’t be worth it. And don’t you think the plan is probably to go unearth a bunch of Max Muncy’s and Chris Taylors to platoon with Belt, Crawford, etc????? You don’t need to ditch our best pitcher to find those dudes……

If you guys want to watch the Willie Mac celebration of life there is a link in here that should work:

https://abc7news.com/sports/watch-live-tomorrow-sf-giants-to-celebrate-willie-mccoveys-life/4642219/

If you are going to the celebration you should take public trans. The Giants aren’t opening Parking Lot A for some unknown reason. Sounds like Unca Chuck is gonna be there, good for him. If anyone goes please email me some pics.

Come on down? The most encouraging thing about this is that they found someone nationally desirable to take this job. That tells me he thinks there’s something to work with here. If there is, I don’t see it. Old, slow, weak hitters, an average pitching staff, a terrible farm system, a bloated payroll….

Well, I guess that’s what he’s got to fix, right?

Baggs had an interesting comment in his article at The Athletic:

“You do not lure someone like Zaidi with money. You lure him with creative control. You lure him with intellectual freedom”

So that means change is coming. Though nothing is going to change immediately. We need a house cleaning, Zaidi knows this.

Yesterday’s old school thread was fun, thanks to those who contributed. I was surprised no one mentioned “going to the library” but maybe literally nobody does that anymore. What’s going on down at the library these days?

Ok, today let’s springboard to the future. 50 years from now. Think of something that is normal now that you don’t think will exist or happen in 50 years. For instance, it’s unthinkable for segregation to exist today but a little over 50 years ago it still did.

I’m gonna go with watering your plants or washing your car. Water will be too valuable to waste on something like that in 50 years. Hoses outside your house will no longer exist. Does that sound stupid?

Stupid like this?

Regarding the Gray for Panik trade proposal: eh, I think the Giants are going to just DFA Panik so the Yankees can scoop him up for free. Panik is slow and weak and injury prone. What value does he bring to a line up?

Ok, let’s take a break from discussing anything baseball related and kick this around: What do you do that is still considered *old school*? For instance, I don’t read newspapers or magazines anymore but maybe you do? I haven’t used a home phone in years. Do you?

The #1 old school thing I do is listen to the radio in my car. Regular free FM radio. 1 station: 107.7 The Bone. Only not in the morning, Lamont and Tonelli are the two dumbest dunderheads on the planet. How do those idiots keep a morning show for all these years? It makes no sense.

If a song comes on I like, I turn it up. If it’s a song I don’t like I usually switch over to KNBR. Commercial comes on, I go back to The Bone. And that’s how I roll all day whenever I’m driving……

Don’t worry, I have a thread for tomorrow all lined up that pivots off today’s thread. So let’s go, what do you do that’s still considered *old school*?

We owe Mad Bum big time…

Sure….give him a percentage of the team when he retires. I’d be down with that. But a big contract? No way. PLEEEEEASE don’t do it. Waste of money. He’s past his prime. Even if he bounces back a little, what good would it do to have a 20 million dollar a year pitcher on this team? Not to mention the fact that his main worth has always been in the post season. You think the 2019 Giants are headed to the post season? How about the 2020 team? Maybe 2022. MAYBE.

The Giants are the WORST at this but they have to learn when to cut the cord. Holding on to fan favorites makes some of the fans feel good but it does nothing for the record of your team.

I wouldn’t want this gig if I were a GM looking for a job. Saddled with a mountain of future payroll, aging players and a shitty farm system, what is there to work with? A ballpark that still looks pretty good?

Being a GM for the SF Giants would be one of the worst jobs you could get right now…..

McCovey did most of his damage before I was born. By the time I was paying attention he was into his second stint with the Giants and obvious not the force he once was. I missed watching the greatness with my own eyes.

My last memory of watching Mac play was during the end of his final season very close to the end of the year. My dad took me to a game and we were sitting along the right field line. McCovey slowly ambled to the plate as a pinch hitter. He ended up lining a ball into the outfield and I remember 2 things: 1: how big the finish of his swing was. The bat seemed to wrap all the way around his body twice on the same swing. 2) how loud the crowd got when he got the hit. They knew what was up.

Fair winds and following seas, Stretch. You earned it.

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DJLoo said, on July 29, 2012 at 11:02 am (Edit)

I share all those awesome childhood memories of Stretch that you guys have the ability to lay out so eloquently. So as always you can count on me for a less cheerful one.

Mays & McCovey came to a card show/autograph signing thing in 1985. I was stunned to hear about it – the memorabilia craze hadn’t really taken off yet. It was held in the gymnasium of a Catholic School in Bensonhurst, Brooklyn. Another hero of mine, Joe Pepitone was also there. Autographs were cheap – maybe $20 for Mays, less for McCovey, and way less for Pepi. Laughed it up and took a great picture with Joe. Got to the M & M table where they were sitting side by side. Mays was somber and wouldn’t even look at me. McCovey was pleasant and shook my hand. I asked if they would allow my friend to snap a picture of me standing behind them. McCovey said sure and Mays grunted something. In the picture Stretch has a big smile. Mays looks like he’s getting a colonoscopy. Later on I was just hanging around outside across the street. McCovey came out (all alone!) limping visibly. I was struck by his outfit. Looked like he picked it up from the Salvation Army. An ill-fitting red checkered sport jacket and bright red pants that were at least 3 inches too short. I yelled out, “need a ride, Willie?”. He waved and said, “I’m alright, man!”. I stayed where I was and watched him slowly hobble down 65th Street. To me, it was the picture of a man down on his luck. He turned left at the corner and disappeared from my view. I have no idea how he could’ve had any idea where he was going around there.
I remember hoping that the neighborhood Guinz-aloons wouldn’t give him a hard time…