THE San Francisco Giants Blog

Bum Doing Bum Things

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on August 9, 2019

That was a calm, meditative diversion from what’s been going on around here lately, nice. With the dearth of quality pitching across the league it’s going to be a tough sell telling me Young Z didn’t receive any decent offers for Bum or Smith. Usually the offers get leaked out. I really need to see what they were just so I can finally shit, shower and shave. 🙂

Great opportunity for Black Shoes tonight. At some point I’d like to see one of these young pitchers stand up and say “I’m not like the rest. I will man up and pitch strong through this season.”

I’m not holding my breath.

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97 Responses

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  1. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:19 am

    probably the least surprising thing I’ve seen this year. I hope the Mets like hitters who blast the ball straight into the belly of the shift over and over and over and over and……

  2. willedav said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:36 am

    I thought that SI article did good job of covering it. None of the big boys could make a deal to improve themselves, LA ATL NY Yanks and return for Stroman (who is under control and not a rental) was minimal It’s not because there weren’t enough candidates, they didn’t meet asking prices because of this nonsense of overvaluing their prospects vs. chance to win a WS

    . If Z was gonna deal with them, he knew exactly who he wanted and laid it out. They wouldn’t cough up, end of story. Posey and the room had zero to do with GM level personnel decisions. Z is just better businessman than that.
    The Yankees SP rotation? the dodgers back end of pen? the Braves seriously think Melancon solves all their pitching issues, in the playoffs???

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:47 am

      Posey and rest having “zero” to do with it is absolute conjecture on your part. It may or may not have.

      • willedav said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:26 am

        And yours of course. I get not liking them just can’t get to them forcing Z’s hand and taking over his job.

  3. willedav said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:42 am

    You can add Cards Brewers and A’s to that group too. A’s and Bum would be a perfect fit. Pains me to say it but they have bunch of power guys and solid farm that would be well known to Z. And the A’s have same problem they had last year if they do get in—who do you start when you need 1 win to get past WC?

    • gianthead said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:57 am

      I had tossed the A’s idea and would have made thorough sense but I had not seen any rumor mill discussion of their interest…was not on Bum’s no trade list and he would have not had to move so likely would have been win-win all the way around..

  4. gianthead said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:54 am

    The Mets snookered the Blue Jays on Stroman with lower-end prospects and with Stroman signed for next year so it is a lock less was offered for Bum…question is what was on the table for Smith and maybe Watson (I’m still not trading either to the Flodgers)? Both should have been moved but definitely Smith..

  5. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:02 am

    Look, WillieD, you are an all time Flapper who’s commitment to the team and the blog is unquestioned. But I have to say this: You are the one being inflexible about this to say Posey and the vets had ZERO to do with the GM level decisions (Z’s). I have said from the beginning that there are 2 obvious narratives: 1) offers weren’t good enough 2) Z got bullied by players and fans. I have also said consistently that neither narrative would surprise me but I strongly believe it was 1.
    Did you hear Baggs on the radio the week before the deadline? He’s said this multiple times if you missed it. He said “Z made some mistakes early on and his decisions rubbed some of the players the wrong way.” We actually know this to be FACT based on Holland’s rant that was recorded. Baggs then went on to say “Z doesn’t want to make the same mistake at the deadline. He knows how important Bum is to the clubhouse.”
    So I am not pulling this shit out of my ass. My opinion is based on everything I hear and read from others who know more than I do. I am flexible enough to accept two narratives. And I trust that at some point, and it usually happens, we will get an idea from the national guys what was offered for Bum and/or Smith.
    This “Zero” stuff is just made up by you. Maybe you’re right but at least say “that’s my opinion, I actually don’t know shit for sure”. And based on what Baggs (and also Jenkins) have said, you are absolutely wrong that it had ZERO impact (on Z)

    • willedav said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:35 am

      bottom line though Z did what he wanted to do whether room liked it or not. That’s his job to get better players on the roster. Holland got dumped because he sucked, even after he went to the pen. Pom and M too.

      And YES, you are completely right–I don’t know at all what was offered by whom, it’s just my opinion.
      But what the players want I don’t see being a factor—and acquiring Gennett plus an IF prospect on same day that meant Panik their long time buddy was toast, tells me Z didn’t care whose feathers he ruffled.

      The fact team started playing better I do believe strengthened his hand and he didn’t feel need to make the move to trade Bum or Smith. that meant he felt better about demanding more. But I still feel ultimately the other teams that might have been interested just didn’t want to give up any of whom he wanted, only lesser prospects. And rather than take less, he said no it wasn’t going to work.

  6. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:09 am

    And I get that the way you worded your comment that you also included other GM’s. That doesn’t mean it didn’t affect Z greatly. Unless you’re saying that no offers at all came thru. Did Z balk because the offers didn’t blow him away? Fuck it, did an offer have to blow him away. Decent prospects should have been accepted for Bum and/or Smith and while we still don’t know what was offered we can assume it wasn’t total shit.

  7. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:22 am

    I mean, shit, Z got decent prospect for fucking Melatonin and Dyson and Black and Pom! You’re telling me he couldn’t have gotten a little more for Bum and Smith? Sorry, I don’t believe that

  8. wilcojoe said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:26 am

    I really think the Astros and Yankees were the only AL teams in on Bum. I think Cashman and Lunhow were playing chess and once one struck a deal, the other would follow. However Luhnow waited till the last possible minute to pull the trigger on Greinke, thereby running the clock out on Cashmans chance to snag Bumgarner.

    Keep in mind, Luhnow waited till the final minute of the 2017 waiver deadline to grab Verlander. So he has experience in being patient. The Astros gave up a lot for Greinke and my guess is they had to overpay Arizona in order to get them to play along. In Luhnows mind the overpay was worth it to leave the Yanks out in the cold.

  9. wilcojoe said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:30 am

    I actually think the Greinke deal could end up hurting Houston this year. . He is not a big game pitcher and I think the postseason pressure will get to him. That wouldn’t have been the case with Bum as we all know.

  10. blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:44 am

    I don’t think Z cares 2 shits about any player’s complaint, e.g., after Holland’s rant, he was relegated to long-relief appearances out of the bullpen . . . and then a one way ticket to “Palookaville” AKA Chicago for cash considerations.

    Zaidi was brought here to make major changes, which he has already done (Melancon, and all these AAAA players coming through the revolving door). Next season after Bochy is gone, he will have a manager and TELL HIM who to play/platoon. Besides, does anyone think with the pathetic play of the so-called “core,” that Z cares what anyone thinks? Other than an owner (such as Johnson) and that guy (forgot his name) who took Baer’s spot, no one tells Z what to do.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:14 am

      lol, but he does care. And he should care, he’s not managing robots. Fuck Holland nobody cares about him. But the core does have a lot a voice in the clubhouse as well they should. And I am TELLING YOU, Jesus it’s like nobody reads what I write, that both Baggs AND Jenkins have said on KNBR, multiple times, that Z understands he made some rookie GM mistakes when he first got here (jettisoning players back and forth) and irritating the players. Holland might not matter as much as the core but he was a leader in the clubhouse and he was speaking for the group not just himself.

  11. alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:03 am

    His name is Rob Dean, who was thrown into the fire after Crazy Larry took exception to musical chairs with his wife.

  12. pawliekokonuts said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:14 am

    As for the Magnus / williedav contretemps, I refer to Soren Kierkegaard, sort of: it ain’t strictly EITHER/OR.

  13. pawliekokonuts said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:15 am

    As for the Giants and their ‘surge,’ bardball.com just posted my poem about it! http://bardball.com/

    • zumiee said, on August 9, 2019 at 4:39 pm

      Very nice!

  14. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:17 am

    it was also reported, many times, that Bochy and the players wanted him to keep the team together. That is fact, I heard those words come out of Bochy’s mouth as well as Posey and Bum. Unless I dreamed that, lqtm

  15. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:17 am

    I suppose a third narrative is that Baggs and Jenkins are lying. I don’t think that’s too realistic tho

  16. pawliekokonuts said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:36 am

    Did anybody see this SI article about baseball mud? I knew, from Ralph Kiner, I believe, decades ago it was from the Delaware River. Why this guy doesn’t hold MLB hostage is stupefying or stupid or amusing or noble.

    https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/08/07/baseball-mud-rawlings?utm_source=si.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=social-share-article&utm_content=20190809

  17. blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:41 am

    Flav, I read everything you write. lol. I actually, think that there are at least a half dozen scenarios of why he didn’t trade Bum, Smith, or any other player on the roster. You’ve identified 2, and because he’s dealing with 29 other clubs, the possibilities are endless.

    I again point to the fact, that every sports publication that I have read (at least 6-8) said the Giants were “Winners.” He also satisfied fans (even though we have played shitty since the trade deadline, my understanding is that Bum got numerous standing ovations last night). At the time of the trade deadline – without using hindsight – does anyone think he made a wrong decision?

    I do agree he’s not a machine and he did consider the feelings of fans, but was that an overriding factor, I doubt it. Same thing regarding the players. Remember, every publication said he was listening to any and all offers on not only Bum, but other players on the roster as well. Yeah, compared to Sabevans – Z is an analytical robot. Consequently, I am happy he is in charge and making the decisions today . . . and not those guys.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:55 am

      I can see this take. I just didn’t care for the *zero impact* that WillieD said. And as SanDawg has told me, my negativity has probably been wearing a little on the more positive voices at the blog. I get that, I just don’t think my negativity is unwarranted. It may be too repetitive or overbearing but shit we don’t have anything else to kick around in this lost year and this is the stuff that’s on my mind. 🙂

      • blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 10:05 am

        Again, great post Flav . . . Just speaking for myself – three years of putrid baseball after winning not one, not two, but three World Series, has made me very cynical about what the fuck is going on in the Giants organization. I am flabbergasted that we were on top of the world and for 3 seasons have been non-entities in MLB.

  18. unca_chuck said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:43 am

    I’m sure it’s a mixture of all of this. Bochy’s last ride, the last gasp of the core, the fans hoping against hope for a playoff run, Zaidi’s reluctance to alienate an already fractious relationship with the players, the FB wives, and the players themselves.

    Frankly, Z did a shit-ton of stuff with the pieces he had available. And no one got bank for the starters that DID get moved. Grienke got 4 decent prospects. And Grienke has 2.4 years left on his deal. Stroman got little to nothing and he has an arb year.

    Bummie;s a rental. As has come to pass, it looks like teams (not named Hou) don’t want to deal prospects for players. AZ was floundering with Grienke so they look to get the better end of this, but both sides could win.

    I think the fact that Bummie has ALWAYS stated his undying loyalty to the Giants as part of the discussion. He would likely come back here on a team -friendly deal anyway, so that may have affected any deal.

    • blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:51 am

      Great points Unca!

  19. unca_chuck said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:44 am

    And yeah, I thought the Youtube game was pretty cool. The between innings stuff was good, bad and awful at times, but it beats Kars for Kids but 10,000,000 miles. I;m really liking Estes. He has settled in nicely as an announcer.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:53 am

      I like Estes a lot too. I wasn’t sure who it was at first and I was like “who’s that guy? He’s saying some good shit.”

  20. unca_chuck said, on August 9, 2019 at 10:01 am

    In breaking news shocking no one, Mets sign Panik to a one year deal.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 10:11 am

      belly of the shift gonna take a beatin’

  21. unca_chuck said, on August 9, 2019 at 11:15 am

    Maybe Chili dog can help him.

  22. Stan Shell said, on August 9, 2019 at 11:27 am

    Blade:”I am flabbergasted that we were on top of the world and for 3 seasons have been non-entities in MLB.”
    Blade, I contend we had a five year run where we had a good team (not the best) that got hot and lucky three of those years. Did anybody think we were going to sweep Verlander and Detroit? Now we have lost the MOJO of those years, but it is basically the same cast only older. Bochy did a good job, also.

    Chance for you guys to see the 49rs first game opponent (my star-crossed Bucs) tonight at 4:30 on NFL channel.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 11:51 am

      come on, it’s not even close to the same cast. The pitching in 2010 and 2012 was miles better. And the game has changed, we don’t have the sticks to compete anymore. Look at the home runs getting hit now. Get TODAY’s cast and maybe we could compete.

    • blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 12:35 pm

      “Lucky?” I’ve mentioned Roman philosopher Seneca’s quote about luck here a couple of times over the years and I believe it unequivocally . . . “Luck is where opportunity meets preparation.”

      In other words, there is no such thing as luck. However, as I said above, it’s only my contention that we were on “. . . top of the of the world.” I respect what you wrote, but disagree with it.

      • djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 12:47 pm

        Plagerized by John Wooden…

  23. alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 12:15 pm

    SS Bo Bichette what a start to his career 20-49 .408 BA
    4HR’s and set a major league record with 9 straight games hitting a double!
    Talk about building blocks for the Bluejays… 2 HOF kids in Vlad Guerrero Jr,Cavan Biggio,and now Bo Bichette wow 😮 exciting future going forward for Toronto..

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 12:37 pm

      exactly. He rakes. And there are young guys littered all over MLB doing the same thing. Get guys like that, we can compete. I think we can get guys like that, btw. It’s just that none of them are currently at the mlb level.

    • blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 12:39 pm

      AK, I have no idea what the current Blue Jays attendance is, but if those 3 kids – with that “Rock Star” name recognition played in San Francisco – we would sell out every night at least for the first few seasons, regardless of our place in the standings, and perhaps even their development progress (to some extent).

      • alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 1:49 pm

        No doubt about it Blade, this is the young core of the future the Giants used to have when Posey,Crawford,Lincecum,Cain,Bum and others were young and producing W/S championships. The Bluejays also have 3 exciting young outfielders with power in Gurriel his older brother plays for the Astros, Gricuk(sp)and Hernandez 19 bombs for the 1st 2 and 15 for Hernandez & the 4th outfielder Fisher has 10!
        Once this team develops some starting pitching watch out..

  24. sandog said, on August 9, 2019 at 1:40 pm

    Mets designating Echavarria to make room for Panik. Hell, I think he could help us. I’ve always kind of liked him.

    • djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 2:25 pm

      Me, too Dawg. A “cool player” as Willedav would say.
      Panik in starting line up tonight – hitting 8th…

      • alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 3:07 pm

        What number is Panik gonna be given?Gooden’s #16 is available..

      • djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 3:58 pm

        He is wearing #2…

      • zumiee said, on August 9, 2019 at 5:03 pm

        Because he’s been playing like doo-doo.
        Har dee har har!

  25. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 5:10 pm

  26. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 5:11 pm

    Duggar is like my 6th favorite outfielder on this team so I’m not sweating this loss.

    • blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 5:55 pm

      Quite an endorsement Flav! As we currently only have 4 outfielders on the roster. lqtm.

      Regardless, as I said yesterday – zero loss in my opinion. Essentially, I am hoping this ends the Duggar experiment to hand him a starting job. He failed.

  27. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 5:17 pm

    PK wrote a poem that’s currently at the top of this website, check it out. (nice and positive, see I can do this!)
    http://bardball.com/

  28. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 5:44 pm

    1. Donovan Solano (R) 2B
    2. Austin Slater (R) RF
    3. Evan Longoria (R) 3B
    4. Buster Posey (R) 1B
    5. Stephen Vogt (L) C
    6. Kevin Pillar (R) CF
    7. Brandon Crawford (L) SS
    8. Joey Rickard (R) LF
    9. Tyler Beede (R) P

  29. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 5:44 pm

    Panik 0 for 2 so far. Fly out & K…

  30. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 6:24 pm

    The nonsense continues. Rendon’s routine fly to left somehow clears the wall at Citifield…

  31. sandog said, on August 9, 2019 at 6:27 pm

    I hope you guys are wrong about Duggar. I love his speed and aggressive style of play and I think he plays the hell out of centerfield.
    Do I think he is a future all star and someone we can build the team around? No. But I think he could be a real nice 4th or 5th outfielder on a good team. Maybe our version of a prime Juan Lagares.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 6:45 pm

      can’t stay healthy. Did you see that play he hurt himself this time on? I mean, it was kind of a dive but nothing out of the ordinary. And then he’s just destroyed.

      • alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:00 pm

        Agree Duggar is just the left-handed version of Mac Williamson…

  32. zumiee said, on August 9, 2019 at 6:52 pm

    The Facebook ladies were shredding Zaidi for basically trading Panik for a guy, Gennett, who’s doing lousy so far.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:20 pm

      Panik should have been DFA’d 2 years ago.

      • djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:23 pm

        He just got his first hit as a Met…

  33. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:22 pm

    Saw on Facebook that good ol Irish Kevin lost his brother. That sucks. He had the same bday as me, though born many years before me.

  34. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:32 pm

    If they move the bullpens and expand the netting, there should be a lot of ball dudes down at the unemployment office next year. Good. Part of the housecleaning.

    And the fuckin’ Mets win again with a 4 run 9th…

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:40 pm

      agreed. We missed out on an entire generation of hot ladies down there because of stupid Left Coast politics. I’m ready for those old men to hit the bricks, something that might literally be safer for them to do rather than tumble off those tiny chairs and stagger after screaming foul balls.

  35. Macdog said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:33 pm

    Man, the Mets are on fire.

  36. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:44 pm

    FWAR!

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:48 pm

      Power, speed, defense. That’s what you need in today’s game and while Pillar is a little light on the power compared to other teams he’s fucking Babe Ruth for us.

  37. Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 7:49 pm

    a stat that should embarrass all those who played before him

  38. alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:05 pm

    Maybe Beede needs to ditch those black shoes for some Elvin Bishop’s traveling shoes…

  39. Macdog said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:06 pm

    Hey Joey!

  40. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:08 pm

  41. sandog said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:13 pm

    Slater stranded at third. That ain’t too cool.

    Ok, I really forced that one…..

    And yes, I agree that tumble by Duggar looked pretty tame. Something in there must not have been fully healed.

  42. zumiee said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:23 pm

    Flannery did a nice job on the Anthem.

    • alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:26 pm

      Yeah who was the BIG BOY, the guy from Lost?

      • sandog said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:30 pm

        Hurley. I’m ashamed I know that because I couldn’t stand that show and I’m not a sci-fi guy at all, but my daughter loved that show and I used to suck it up from time to time and watch.

      • alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:41 pm

        Yeah that’s the guy dog!
        I actually saw him in an episode of Hawaii 5-0 and the dude was 4 times fatter then he was in Lost.I feel for him some, maybe turning into the next John Candy obese victim..

  43. zumiee said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:48 pm

    Longo is a most excellent rally-killer.

    • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:51 pm

      Everyone over 30 on this team sucks.

      • Flavor said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:53 pm

        i said that without looking. Just looked. Vogt and Pablo don’t suck. All other over 30 year old Giants smoke copious amounts of pole

      • djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:01 pm

        Good call, Flavor!

      • alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:02 pm

        Pillar is 30 I would say he sucks,but on the flavor meter he’s Superman!

    • Macdog said, on August 9, 2019 at 8:53 pm

      But he’s our top WAR guy!

  44. Macdog said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:01 pm

    Tie Vogt!

  45. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:02 pm

  46. alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:03 pm

    Vogt got both butt cheeks in that massive water splash!!!🚀

  47. Macdog said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:13 pm

    Solano 3-4, now there’s a leadoff hitter.

    • blade3colorado said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:16 pm

      He’s over 30 too and past his milk date, but still fresh, unlike our core sour milk duds.

      • alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:31 pm

        Blade.. Toronto only has 2 guys on their 25 man roster over 30,their milk never expires unlike the Giants with curled milk with 12 freaking guys over 30,that’s half the roster!

  48. alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:16 pm

    That’s going to be Zman’s top priority next year, getting YOUNGER! Right now they have 12 players out of their 25 man active roster OVER 30! Has to be the oldest roster in the bigs I assume.

  49. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:16 pm

    I never supported or understood the concept of Belt leading off…

  50. sandog said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:24 pm

    Yeah, thank goodness we didn’t get that guy…..

  51. djloo27 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:25 pm

    Glad we held on to Watson…

  52. Macdog said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:27 pm

    Another sucky 30-something.

  53. sandog said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:30 pm

    I mean holy crap, that was crushed. A splash hit into right center.

  54. alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:34 pm

    Harper says: “Elementary Watson”

  55. snarkk said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:35 pm

    Just parachuting into this game.
    Looks like the 5-hit shutout I wanted from Beede didn’t happen…

    • sandog said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:40 pm

      He cruised through the first 2 innings and then couldn’t throw a strike. And this ump has a strike one that is 2 feet wide.

      • snarkk said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:45 pm

        Thanks.
        Either the guy is running out of gas into too many innings territory, kinda BF’s thinking; or he’s just a mental midget and can’t get over that issue. Maybe some of both…

  56. alleykat69 said, on August 9, 2019 at 9:51 pm

    Yeah CB Buckner is one of the worse umps along with Joe West&Angel Hernadez! Shit I know these guys get graded out in the off season( probably horrible) but does baseball committes ever get rid of one? Probably no with the umpire union involved..

  57. zumiee said, on August 9, 2019 at 11:25 pm

    Jansen blows the save; the Dodgers end up losing.
    Groovy.


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