Willie, the years was 1954 and the team was Cleveland. But, I don’t think it was Dusty Rhodes series as much as Willie Mays. Bases loaded and Vic Wertz hit a ball to dead center. Mays made the famous catch. Indians didn’t score and went on to losing four straight.
Mac, Bob Lemon was one of the big four. Mike Garcia, Early Winn and some guy named Bob Houltman (I had to look him up) averaged 20 wins with Lemon. Bob Feller was JUST a 13 game winner.
Loo, the only Giant pitcher I recall is Sal Maglie. Back in ’54 I was a SF Seals fan with Cleveland my favorite team. I hated the Yankees.
from what I understand there were 2 on (Doby on 2b Rosen on 1b) no outs and score tied at the time Wertz hammered the ball Mays caught. Doby made it to 3b but Mays throw, something I believe he was always very proud of, held Rosen at 1b. Next guy up walked but relief pitcher got next two Indians out and game remained tied.
Never heard of Bob Houltman, but after looking it up you must have meant Art Houtteman who I also never heard of but won 15 for Cleveland in ’54. Anyway, good big 4 question, Seal…
Funny story too about that inning, which was top 8th. according to wiki, Sal Maglie started it and allowed the two baserunners and mgr. Durocher replaced him with Don Liddle. After the Wertz 450 ft fly out, Leo came out to switch relievers and Liddle supposedly said to a coach, “Well I got my man.” The new reliever walked bases loaded then got K and fly out and Giants escaped unscored upon.
Still wondering what could of been in the 62 W/S if Juan Marichal did not have to pitch the clinching last day of the season and was not able to pitch until game 4 which they won, but he had to leave after 4 innings injuring his pitching hand and never pitched again even after the delay of 3 games starting gm 7 due to rain.
Hitting sure was at a premium in that series as all the bigtime sluggers Mays,McCovey,Cepeda,Mantle&Maris all struggled hitting low.250 are Mendoza line numbers which seem shocking.Guys like (SF)Chuck Hiller&Tom Tresh (NY)we’re leading they’re teams in hitting.
Yeah and I believe the Giants played some exhibition games in Japan one year and Marichal got sick over there and was not the same pitcher that year struggling with endurance..
This from Mays book I’m reading by Charles Einstein:
“In the 1959 AS game in Pittsburgh, Willie Mays batted in the winning run for the NL with a triple in the 8th inning. ‘Harvey Kuenn gave it an honest pursuit’ wrote Bob Stevens in the next morning’s SF Chron, ‘but the only CF in baseball who could have caught it hit it.’ “
I always loved that “I got my man!” story. Growing up, my friend’s dad told that story with much enthusiasm and we always got a big kick out of it.
Mays has an NY hat on the picture, but it does have a spring training vibe. I would guess they trained in Florida in those NYG days, so that is set in Florida. Either way, what a great pic.
Flew back yday and dont have time to see the responses on voted fraud debate. The big fear and there are cases most especially Miami Dade county in recent elections where mailed in ballots by the thousands have gone missing. Just in the 2018 election they found thousands of ballots in an election officials car. There are other cases people have fraudulently signed people up to vote by mail or convinced people to sign up by mail and then those ballots have been absconded from people’s mail boxes. I dont think it is a major issue but it is an issue of how tamper proof are elections are. And there are abuses on both sides, but in recent years there have obviously been some very close elections. 500 or so fraudulent absentee ballots could have swung Florida in 2000 to Gore and history on a number of things would have been quite different…
Mays in 1954 was back from season off for military service, which often involved playing lot of baseball.
Set NL on fire with 41 HRs 110 rbis (first of 10 with over 100 rbis) slash line.345/.667/1.078
He had the catch and good Series going 4-14 scored 4 drove in 3 with 1 double.
But Rhodes had 3 games of his career.
won game 1 in 10th with 3 run walk off pinch hit HR off Bob Lemon that went down short RF porch less than 300 ft.
Game 2 pinch hit rbi single in 5th inning and HR in 7th 3-1 Giants W.
Game 3 hit 2 run pinch single with bases loaded in 6-2 W
all above per Baseball Almanac 1954 WS (great read) and named Series MVP..
Wound up with totals of 4-6 2 HRs 7 rbis
When I was a kid in the early ’70s playing in pick-up baseball games (those don’t exist anymore, of course), if someone made a catch over their head, running away from the infield, we called it a “Willie Mays catch.” My friends and I all knew what a “Willie Mays catch” was. But…..I’ve since wondered…..how did we know it was a Willie Mays catch? It happened in ’54. It’s not like we saw footage of the catch. Maybe one or two of us saw a photo in a book. Yet we all knew the Willie Mays catch. I think the knowledge of it was just passed down from some older brothers and fathers, and little league coaches. It had to have been that. It was a time when baseball was still such a huge part of the sports culture and the culture in general that lots of people knew the “Willie Mays catch.”
They used to see the May’s catch and Bobby Thompson’s homer quite a bit just watching baseball shows. Same with Don Larson’s perfect game. I think I saw em so many times i felt like I was there.
Yeah we just use to call Willie’s catches “The Basket Ketch” which he actually used all the time unless runners were on base.
I use to always practice that one and also tried to perfect Juan Marichal’s leg kick which you really needed good flexibility and balance to master it which of course Juan could do and me not so much.
Spot on AK . . . I never heard the “Willie Mays catch,” except where you might say, “he caught that like Willie Mays” and 9 times out of 10, they were referring to his “basket catch.” Also, good point about Mays ONLY catching the ball that way when runners were not on base or he was scrambling in to the infield for a blooper.
Quite frankly, Mays was the smartest “man in the room” (field) when he was playing baseball and that included the 2 managers usually.
Thanks Blade.
And your spot on as well about Mays being the smartest man on the field including the managers!
Yeah I had the privilege of seeing Mays play many games at the Stick, from his superb base running instincts, to how he positioned himself in center to each hitters tendencies, plus factoring in the wind and what it did to balls they’re was no one better, just a complete ball player with no weaknesses..
I did not remember Don Larsen pitching for the Giants and he won game 4 in relief in the 62 W/S game taking over for Juan Marichal who hurt his hand bunting like Loo mentioned.Guy throws a perfect game for the Yanks in 1956 W/S then beats them in 62 kinda cool 😎.
Overall his career wasn’t that great 81-91 but a perfect game in a W/S makes up for a lot!
His second big league season for Baltimore he went 3-21 yikes 😱
I still believe between the 2 years of military commitment in his 1952-1953 seasons in his prime and Candlestick Park robbing him of so many Homers Willie Mays could of been the alltime HR King! Aaron played in a bandbox and never had to serve so that played a major role.
I’m excluding Bonds cause of steroids, just to tainted for me to have to cheat to get the record..
You can see part of the word Phoenix on a sign on the wall. Speaking of writing on the wall, Republicans have tried mail-in voter fraud in the same states they’re targeting for voter suppression. They’ve been caught and prosecuted successfully. Which tends to suggest that mail-in balloting can be secure. Now they’re focusing on suppression–purging registered voters and closing old polling places. Since the US Supreme Court gutted the Voting Rights Act of 1964 things have gotten much worse. This clearly happened:
Hey Loo, found something interesting re: Mays losing out 1962 MVP.
Here’s Einstein from Willie’s time: “the charge is heard from time to time that the Baseball Writers Association of America, from whose ranks certain panels vote for MVP and HOF selections, tilts in favor of media heavy New York. But the anti-New York strain is there too. There is little question that the influence of that group was what denied election to the HOF of Joe DiMaggio in his first year of eligibility, and there is little question that the same prejudice cost Mays his shot at becoming MVP in1962…”
“…in 1962 he (Mays) was still viewed as a New Yorker..” and so lost MVP race to wills by 7 votes.
Further Einstein is talking about when Mays first became eligible in 1979 for HOF and voting had taken place in January for induction ceremony to be held that summer, “Mays…wanted little truck with any glowing predictions. ‘Joe D. didn’t even make it the first year he was up’, Mays said warily. ‘And look what happened to me in sixty-two.’ “
Republican shenanigans. The Democratic party and the Democrat Governor in Wisc tried to postpone the election but the state Supreme Court and the US Supreme Court (which way do they lean?) both voted against it saying the Governor overstepped his authority.= in trying to protect the citizens of the state.
So, in a nutshell, fuck the people. Let them get sick and die voting because the Governor didn’t kiss enough ass.
Hey great work putting those stats together Loo!
So it looks like Mays out homered Aaron disregarding the 62-63 Mets stat ..41 to 32 plus Mays missed 2 years cause of the military which would of added to his total.
I find that one stat with Mays pretty crazy at the Braves Park in Boston where in 1951 he was 0-23 there with 8 walks? Didn’t he start his career like 0-20 something,but Durocher said don’t worry kid you’re in the lu everyday, stop pressing! It must of helped him cause he did end up hitting 20 HR’s and batted .274 after the bad start..
Lots of sheltering-at-home musicians are performing online from their homes. Here’s Curt Smith of Tears For Fears performing the song “Mad World” with his daughter.
A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball
Say Hey! That is a bad ass picture. I have never seen that one, before.
Be safe and stay healthy Flappers.
Very cool shot. Phoenix I’d imagine?
Mays sayin to kid:
Remember kid if you eat Rainbo bread everyday it builds strong bodies 12 ways!
And yes Flappers bunker down and stay safe!
Willie, the years was 1954 and the team was Cleveland. But, I don’t think it was Dusty Rhodes series as much as Willie Mays. Bases loaded and Vic Wertz hit a ball to dead center. Mays made the famous catch. Indians didn’t score and went on to losing four straight.
Mac, Bob Lemon was one of the big four. Mike Garcia, Early Winn and some guy named Bob Houltman (I had to look him up) averaged 20 wins with Lemon. Bob Feller was JUST a 13 game winner.
Loo, the only Giant pitcher I recall is Sal Maglie. Back in ’54 I was a SF Seals fan with Cleveland my favorite team. I hated the Yankees.
OSF
from what I understand there were 2 on (Doby on 2b Rosen on 1b) no outs and score tied at the time Wertz hammered the ball Mays caught. Doby made it to 3b but Mays throw, something I believe he was always very proud of, held Rosen at 1b. Next guy up walked but relief pitcher got next two Indians out and game remained tied.
Never heard of Bob Houltman, but after looking it up you must have meant Art Houtteman who I also never heard of but won 15 for Cleveland in ’54. Anyway, good big 4 question, Seal…
Funny story too about that inning, which was top 8th. according to wiki, Sal Maglie started it and allowed the two baserunners and mgr. Durocher replaced him with Don Liddle. After the Wertz 450 ft fly out, Leo came out to switch relievers and Liddle supposedly said to a coach, “Well I got my man.” The new reliever walked bases loaded then got K and fly out and Giants escaped unscored upon.
Still wondering what could of been in the 62 W/S if Juan Marichal did not have to pitch the clinching last day of the season and was not able to pitch until game 4 which they won, but he had to leave after 4 innings injuring his pitching hand and never pitched again even after the delay of 3 games starting gm 7 due to rain.
Hitting sure was at a premium in that series as all the bigtime sluggers Mays,McCovey,Cepeda,Mantle&Maris all struggled hitting low.250 are Mendoza line numbers which seem shocking.Guys like (SF)Chuck Hiller&Tom Tresh (NY)we’re leading they’re teams in hitting.
3days..
Hurt his hand bunting, I believe.
I think he once hurt his ribs sneezing and missed some key starts…
Yeah and I believe the Giants played some exhibition games in Japan one year and Marichal got sick over there and was not the same pitcher that year struggling with endurance..
This from Mays book I’m reading by Charles Einstein:
“In the 1959 AS game in Pittsburgh, Willie Mays batted in the winning run for the NL with a triple in the 8th inning. ‘Harvey Kuenn gave it an honest pursuit’ wrote Bob Stevens in the next morning’s SF Chron, ‘but the only CF in baseball who could have caught it hit it.’ “
I always loved that “I got my man!” story. Growing up, my friend’s dad told that story with much enthusiasm and we always got a big kick out of it.
Mays has an NY hat on the picture, but it does have a spring training vibe. I would guess they trained in Florida in those NYG days, so that is set in Florida. Either way, what a great pic.
In his version, the reliever cooly flipped the ball to Durocher while announcing that he got his guy….
It’s Phoenix, Dog.
You’ll lose your mind from the great link Bozo posted below at 1:42 PM…
Flew back yday and dont have time to see the responses on voted fraud debate. The big fear and there are cases most especially Miami Dade county in recent elections where mailed in ballots by the thousands have gone missing. Just in the 2018 election they found thousands of ballots in an election officials car. There are other cases people have fraudulently signed people up to vote by mail or convinced people to sign up by mail and then those ballots have been absconded from people’s mail boxes. I dont think it is a major issue but it is an issue of how tamper proof are elections are. And there are abuses on both sides, but in recent years there have obviously been some very close elections. 500 or so fraudulent absentee ballots could have swung Florida in 2000 to Gore and history on a number of things would have been quite different…
“The big fear” is that Democrats will dominate elections if all 50 states are allowed to vote by mail. Trump himself said it. We all know it.
Mays in 1954 was back from season off for military service, which often involved playing lot of baseball.
Set NL on fire with 41 HRs 110 rbis (first of 10 with over 100 rbis) slash line.345/.667/1.078
He had the catch and good Series going 4-14 scored 4 drove in 3 with 1 double.
But Rhodes had 3 games of his career.
won game 1 in 10th with 3 run walk off pinch hit HR off Bob Lemon that went down short RF porch less than 300 ft.
Game 2 pinch hit rbi single in 5th inning and HR in 7th 3-1 Giants W.
Game 3 hit 2 run pinch single with bases loaded in 6-2 W
all above per Baseball Almanac 1954 WS (great read) and named Series MVP..
Wound up with totals of 4-6 2 HRs 7 rbis
When I was a kid in the early ’70s playing in pick-up baseball games (those don’t exist anymore, of course), if someone made a catch over their head, running away from the infield, we called it a “Willie Mays catch.” My friends and I all knew what a “Willie Mays catch” was. But…..I’ve since wondered…..how did we know it was a Willie Mays catch? It happened in ’54. It’s not like we saw footage of the catch. Maybe one or two of us saw a photo in a book. Yet we all knew the Willie Mays catch. I think the knowledge of it was just passed down from some older brothers and fathers, and little league coaches. It had to have been that. It was a time when baseball was still such a huge part of the sports culture and the culture in general that lots of people knew the “Willie Mays catch.”
They used to see the May’s catch and Bobby Thompson’s homer quite a bit just watching baseball shows. Same with Don Larson’s perfect game. I think I saw em so many times i felt like I was there.
show
Yeah we just use to call Willie’s catches “The Basket Ketch” which he actually used all the time unless runners were on base.
I use to always practice that one and also tried to perfect Juan Marichal’s leg kick which you really needed good flexibility and balance to master it which of course Juan could do and me not so much.
Spot on AK . . . I never heard the “Willie Mays catch,” except where you might say, “he caught that like Willie Mays” and 9 times out of 10, they were referring to his “basket catch.” Also, good point about Mays ONLY catching the ball that way when runners were not on base or he was scrambling in to the infield for a blooper.
Quite frankly, Mays was the smartest “man in the room” (field) when he was playing baseball and that included the 2 managers usually.
Thanks Blade.
And your spot on as well about Mays being the smartest man on the field including the managers!
Yeah I had the privilege of seeing Mays play many games at the Stick, from his superb base running instincts, to how he positioned himself in center to each hitters tendencies, plus factoring in the wind and what it did to balls they’re was no one better, just a complete ball player with no weaknesses..
I did not remember Don Larsen pitching for the Giants and he won game 4 in relief in the 62 W/S game taking over for Juan Marichal who hurt his hand bunting like Loo mentioned.Guy throws a perfect game for the Yanks in 1956 W/S then beats them in 62 kinda cool 😎.
Overall his career wasn’t that great 81-91 but a perfect game in a W/S makes up for a lot!
His second big league season for Baltimore he went 3-21 yikes 😱
I still believe between the 2 years of military commitment in his 1952-1953 seasons in his prime and Candlestick Park robbing him of so many Homers Willie Mays could of been the alltime HR King! Aaron played in a bandbox and never had to serve so that played a major role.
I’m excluding Bonds cause of steroids, just to tainted for me to have to cheat to get the record..
https://projects.sfchronicle.com/2020/visuals/giants-spring-training/
Mays in Phoenix back in 52, playing guitar and wearing a cowboy hat.
wow thx man that was fantastic. There’s one shot from 1955 Phoenix resembles the one Flav posted quite a bit
Yep. the Phoenix Elevator company gave it away.
Nice.
Fantastic, Bozo! Thanks!
Made me feel that old Giant pride again.
Also made me feel 337 years old…
You can see part of the word Phoenix on a sign on the wall. Speaking of writing on the wall, Republicans have tried mail-in voter fraud in the same states they’re targeting for voter suppression. They’ve been caught and prosecuted successfully. Which tends to suggest that mail-in balloting can be secure. Now they’re focusing on suppression–purging registered voters and closing old polling places. Since the US Supreme Court gutted the Voting Rights Act of 1964 things have gotten much worse. This clearly happened:
https://www.npr.org/2019/07/30/746800630/north-carolina-gop-operative-faces-new-felony-charges-that-allege-ballot-fraud
Right. To say this a problem on both sides of the aisle is ludicrous.
Gerrymandering as well.
Flipping Virginia blue last Nov was important to undo some horrible Repub gerrymandering. Should happen, assuming the census gets done.
AK, just imagine if Williams played in Yankee stadium, and DiMaggio played in Fenway. They’d both have 800+ home runs.
Mays prolly lost 70-80 home runs to Korea, and another 100 to Candlestick. He would have been close to 800 as well.
Hey Loo, found something interesting re: Mays losing out 1962 MVP.
Here’s Einstein from Willie’s time: “the charge is heard from time to time that the Baseball Writers Association of America, from whose ranks certain panels vote for MVP and HOF selections, tilts in favor of media heavy New York. But the anti-New York strain is there too. There is little question that the influence of that group was what denied election to the HOF of Joe DiMaggio in his first year of eligibility, and there is little question that the same prejudice cost Mays his shot at becoming MVP in1962…”
“…in 1962 he (Mays) was still viewed as a New Yorker..” and so lost MVP race to wills by 7 votes.
Further Einstein is talking about when Mays first became eligible in 1979 for HOF and voting had taken place in January for induction ceremony to be held that summer, “Mays…wanted little truck with any glowing predictions. ‘Joe D. didn’t even make it the first year he was up’, Mays said warily. ‘And look what happened to me in sixty-two.’ “
Willie might have been paid back in 1965, when a great case for Wills could be made…
The guy who was really robbed in ’62 was Tommy Davis…
Wow. I’d never heard that DiMaggio didn’t get in his first year. That’s a crime.
Xoot—if you see this, how was the Wisconsin vote allowed to go off with only 5 polling stations open? What was the rationale to close down all but 5?
Flavor, I don’t know the details about WI. Chuck or Zumie may.
Republican shenanigans. The Democratic party and the Democrat Governor in Wisc tried to postpone the election but the state Supreme Court and the US Supreme Court (which way do they lean?) both voted against it saying the Governor overstepped his authority.= in trying to protect the citizens of the state.
So, in a nutshell, fuck the people. Let them get sick and die voting because the Governor didn’t kiss enough ass.
If I did this right, it shows how Mays and Aaron did during their careers at each others ballparks. I’m exhausted…
Mays at Braves Field (Boston):
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/split_stats.cgi?full=1¶ms=site%7CBOS08%7Cmayswi01%7Cbat%7CAB%7C
Mays at County Stadium (Milwaukee):
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/split_stats.cgi?full=1¶ms=site%7CMIL05%7Cmayswi01%7Cbat%7CAB%7C
Mays at Fulton County Stadium (Atlanta):
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/split_stats.cgi?full=1¶ms=site%7CATL01%7Cmayswi01%7Cbat%7CAB%7C
_________________________________________________________________
Aaron at Polo Grounds (NY):
Note: Disregard 1962 and 1963 vs. Mets
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/split_stats.cgi?full=1¶ms=site%7CNYC14%7Caaronha01%7Cbat%7CAB%7C
Aaron at Seals Stadium (SF)
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/split_stats.cgi?full=1¶ms=site%7CSFO01%7Caaronha01%7Cbat%7CAB%7C
Aaron at Candlestick Park (SF)
https://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/split_stats.cgi?full=1¶ms=site%7CSFO02%7Caaronha01%7Cbat%7CAB%7C
I guess technically it’s not entirely accurate because Mays played his last 2 years at Shea, but you get the idea…
this is great thanks for putting it together
Hey great work putting those stats together Loo!
So it looks like Mays out homered Aaron disregarding the 62-63 Mets stat ..41 to 32 plus Mays missed 2 years cause of the military which would of added to his total.
I find that one stat with Mays pretty crazy at the Braves Park in Boston where in 1951 he was 0-23 there with 8 walks? Didn’t he start his career like 0-20 something,but Durocher said don’t worry kid you’re in the lu everyday, stop pressing! It must of helped him cause he did end up hitting 20 HR’s and batted .274 after the bad start..
And check out Aaron at Candlestick.
Jints woulda swapped him for Don Cardwell by ’66…
lulz
that is fucking hilarious
There are some very creative lunatics out there…
Haven’t laughed like that in a while. Awesome!
Giants TV network is showing a victory over the A’s from last season, tonight at 8 Pacific Time.
Giants coming in were 59-60 mid August. Ten games later after beating A’s twice in a row across the Bay they were 65-65…last time they were .500.
Lots of sheltering-at-home musicians are performing online from their homes. Here’s Curt Smith of Tears For Fears performing the song “Mad World” with his daughter.
awesome, I bet they had a lot of fun together
Late night geezer trivia:
The 1961 Orioles regularly started 2 light hitting outfielders who went on to become HOF managers.
Can you name them?
Dick Williams? and Whitey Herzog?
Amazing!
Might have to hook you up to a polygraph…
Williams I believe. Whitey played?
Kat got it, Chuck…
Can’t believe Whitey was a player.
60 years ago today, the first game was played at candlestick park. Giants beat the Cards 3-1. Tricky Dick the veep was there.
My Candlestick Park lithograph says April 12th, Chuck.
It’s right…
https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/SFN/SFN196004120.shtml
I still don’t know who he was, so this is for you guys who did…
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/best-john-prine-songs-testament-130200833.html