A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball

Negotiation Breakdown

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on June 14, 2020

Tony Clark: “Further dialogue with the league would be futile. It’s time to get back to work. Tell us when and where.”

That statement right there proves this was never about the health and safety of the players. It was always 100% about cold hard cash.

Remember, there is still no agreement on a health and safety protocol. That still needs to get hammered out.

And yet there’s Clark saying “tell us when and where.”


Today’s Trump letter…..

Screenshot 2020-06-14 at 2.37.46 PM

63 Responses

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  1. zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:06 am

    I’m not a lawyer, and I don’t play one on TV; but doesn’t that put all the legal liability for player illness from the virus on MLB?

    • xoot said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:43 am

      You can waive liability prospectively, the way trump supporters are waiving CV19 liability when they sign up to attend his racist rally next weekend. Still, if the union and mlb haven’t reached fundamental agreement on all details, wide waivers may not be part of the deal. What the hell is in that March agreement?

      If things go but then go bad, arbitration grievances could be many (federal labor law governs many claims), and various lawsuits should follow — against mlb and conceivably against the union.

      The owners suck. Meanwhile, the union has an inherent conflict of interest between the high salary members and the low. But health and safety concerns are always union issues, in some industries as important as wages.

      When Bernie’s appointed Sec. of both Labor and HHS next year, and VP Warren takes charge of restocking the National Labor Relations Board with decent human beings, things will be so much better.

  2. zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:09 am

    I’m sure there are lots of players frightened about catching the virus, but they don’t want to publicly appear to be wusses.

  3. sandog said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:16 am

    Break that union like a Kit Kat bar!

  4. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:32 am

    From what I’ve read most of the NBA players opposition to finishing their season is only about being isolated and not being allowed to bring family along for first month. Really haven’t heard much at all lately from MLBPA about safety…in the famous words of Deion Sanders, “It’s all about money.”

  5. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:53 am

    Still thinking about Flav’s advice to the 3rd round draftee who also has full ride to UCLA. On one hand he can sign a contract with slotted bonus approaching nearly $1 million, though he won’t have anywhere to play except for possibly AZ or Florida Fall League. And next year will certainly see contraction of minor league teams especially at lower entry levels, so his competition would be more difficult at the start. And yes he will be riding around in minors once baseball and trying to show his organization he can eventually play at ML level, which will take a few years. Not an easy route and baseball negotiations will continue as Basic Agreement ends 2020.

    On other hand, he has 4-5 years of college paid for. He can live on a beautiful campus and play for an elite school in a tough league vs. good competition for a year or two/three and then reenter draft. He could be drafted even higher, or of course lower. this route also allows him the chance to get an education, work on his skills and mature physically with access to facilities and staff.

    • willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:20 am

      Maybe family has a floor for what type of offer they either accept or utilize alternative of college in the fall.
      Maybe the family is unsure about where MLB is headed (another strike looming?) and wants to back off to get lay of the land.
      Maybe the player has decided MLB is what he’s always wanted to do and is ready to get started right now.

      • Flavor said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:32 am

        The looming strike is certainly a reason to go to UCLA

  6. Stan Shell said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:34 am

    GF doesn’t like my shows while eating dinner so a compromise is South Park (don’t laugh). Watched episode Season 21 Episode 8. It was about no fans for pro football. Showed a quick clip of a game with no fans and it was enough to kill for me any desire to watch pro ball with no fan noise. Completely!

    Announcer: ” There’s the kickoff!”
    Player catches ball and runs forward.
    Player runs into a pile of players.

    That’s it. All emotion gone from the game.
    A glimpse into the future?
    If so, you can have it. BTW, Florida had its biggest spike yesterday. Yeah, we’re ready for some football.


  7. alleykat69 said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:38 am

    And then they’re is Dusty Baker’s kid Darren who did not get drafted and has already decided to go back to Cal then accept a 20k offer.Which was very smart on his part to continue both his education and polish more of his skills in baseball for a better chance to get drafted higher.

    • xoot said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:45 am

      And there’s a smart young man with a lot of smart and knowledgeable advisers helping him.

    • willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 9:25 am

      plus he gets the extra added by NCAA year of eligibility, 2 left to play for Cal if he so desires.

  8. Winder said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:38 am

    Starting at 6:00 am this morning teams are going after undrafted players with a top salary at $20,000.00. To me this would be the perfect time to go after HS players that have the potential talent to make it to the pros. i am pretty sure with added perks like living expenses and possible collage tuition paid if things don’t work out within a few years just might get some attention. Of course I don’t know if that is on the up&up legally but i think it might be.

  9. alleykat69 said, on June 14, 2020 at 9:00 am

    The kid Mrsprtdude was taliking about I believe his name is Jake Vogel from Hunnington Beach HS.He was rated #89 best prospect and the Bums got him with pick 100, a steal,A sure fire Centerfielder with blazing speed( dodger scouts say already top 3 in all they’re players in the speed department with running back speed instincts)but will need to improve with his bat which I’m sure with good coaching he will.
    My guess is he blows off UCLA and signs.You don’t get drafted that high with a good slot money available and blow that off.

  10. Winder said, on June 14, 2020 at 9:03 am

    for people who haven’t seen it this might be interesting


  11. Flavor said, on June 14, 2020 at 9:35 am

    if I was stuck going to Cal I’d do anything to get out of there as soon as possible. Oh Snap!!!!!

    • willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 10:22 am

      mm would you trade football coaches? No way Shaw is going anywhere now unless he bows out.

      • Flavor said, on June 14, 2020 at 10:29 am

        I can’t stand David Shaw. I would welcome nearly anyone as his replacement. Sometimes it’s a good idea to change the message. In Shaw’s case I think that time has come.

  12. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 9:43 am

    The column Winder linked to MLBTR had a whole section of how many players would you protect from each team if there was an expansion draft. I read their stuff a lot and usually scroll through comments too. But, even in this one as in so many others, far too much time and space is wasted as a discussion of baseball gets bogged down with back and forth insults and personalized BS, full of “you are a moron” or go back to Mom’s basement/what sport have you been following type of nonsense.

    I’m glad we can stay healthily above that here even if we disagree about players, mgrs. GMs/FOs, et al. Level of baseball knowledge and understanding is really exemplary; I’ve changed how I think about situations quite often over years based on what I’ve read and learned from others here.

    • Winder said, on June 14, 2020 at 10:10 am

      Yeah, i think there are a lot of people who hang around just to troll on those sites.

    • Flavor said, on June 14, 2020 at 10:19 am

      frankly, all the BS ended here when twin stopped posting regularly in 2015 or so. Hate to say it that way but it’s true.

      • snarkk said, on June 14, 2020 at 2:58 pm

        He was a shit disturber, and enjoyed the insult and abusive approach to repartee.
        Sometimes the insults were amusing; often they were not…

      • Stan Shell said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:18 pm

        I think he loved the attention that many of us gave him, including you, BF. But, he could get very angry on-line. He was immersed in the sporting world as a kid, I guess. He knew his shit.
        Still have that bat, BF?

  13. xoot said, on June 14, 2020 at 11:09 am

    While searching for something else I came across this. How many highlights do we have from last Sept.? iirc, Davis had been struggling after being called up. Got hbp on his hand, too. But then, this. I would take 48 games and a PS to see some of this. Desperate, I suppose.

    • Carstie Clausen said, on June 14, 2020 at 6:02 pm

      Xoot: Nice. Enjoyed it. Could be the brass will give him a good long look when and if…also enjoyed the 3 speculating on might have beens for Matt Williams in that truncated season when he was threatening Maris’ record before roided McGwire and SoSo smashed it…pissing off BB25 in the process, inducing him to put on a show under the then “unofficial” rules. Sportswriters doing the choosing for HOF piss ME off.

  14. dirtnrocksnomo said, on June 14, 2020 at 11:53 am

    • Winder said, on June 14, 2020 at 12:01 pm

      Love the horse and I believe a trotter bugey. From the bodies on the top row it looks like a sold out house.

    • xoot said, on June 14, 2020 at 12:06 pm

      The fans along the top of the wall–that is very cool.

      There’s a LL field at that spot now. lol. Some years later, the Oaks moved south down San Pablo, onto the land where Pixar is now (across from Rudy’s Can’t Fail Cafe, where the servings are huge and the beer cheap). Thus, I suppose, the name of the well-known all-night gambling spot nearby, The Oaks.

  15. zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 12:21 pm

    LeBron James and others have recently formed a voter rights group, as you all probably know. I like his quote here. The group has a great mission.
    “As James told the Times: “Yes, we want you to go out and vote, but we’re also going to give you the tutorial. We’re going to give you the background of how to vote and what they’re trying to do, the other side, to stop you from voting.”

  16. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 12:49 pm

    MLB showing Game 7 1971 World Series…just watched last AB of Clemente’s career, 9th inning strike out swinging on curveball from Pat Dobson. He got nice ovation from Balt fans as he came to the plate. Very quiet stance bat held upright, stood back off the plate. 12 hits in Series including HR in this one, 2-1 victory for Steve Blass and Pirates.

    • zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 1:30 pm

      He played in ‘72, and died later that year. 3,000 hits in his career, exactly.

      • willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 1:55 pm


  17. zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 1:34 pm

    Movie trivia quiz:
    What movie has a character who named his son Roberto, in honor of Clemente?
    What actor played the son’s father?
    And name two other famous actors in the movie.

    • zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 1:39 pm

      The movie is almost 31 years old and is still very relevant, unfortunately.

      • Macdog said, on June 14, 2020 at 2:04 pm

        Do the Right Thing?

        I remember Danny Aiello and Spike Lee in the movie, can’t think of anyone else.

      • alleykat69 said, on June 14, 2020 at 2:13 pm

        I remember Rosie Perez kinda of a break thru movie for her.And Samuel Jackson as well..

      • xoot said, on June 14, 2020 at 2:27 pm

        Spike Lee’s new movie, about to stream I believe, looks like another good one. Da Five Bloods? Something like that.

    • zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 2:28 pm

      Do The Right Thing is a great try, but not correct.
      Here’s a hint: in a supporting role Steve Martin plays a character who gets shot in the leg.

  18. alleykat69 said, on June 14, 2020 at 1:37 pm

    The Seattle Mariners hold the record for most wins in a season 116,
    Yet they’re also the only major league team never to play in the World Series!!
    That’s some crazy shit!!

  19. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 3:26 pm

    @aaronfitt reports Giants signed undrafted FA Carter Williams, LH OF from North Carolina Central out of the MEAC conference.

    • Winder said, on June 14, 2020 at 4:33 pm


  20. sandog said, on June 14, 2020 at 3:34 pm

    Grand canyon!
    Kevin Kleine or something like that

  21. Flavor said, on June 14, 2020 at 4:19 pm

    The movie Colors came out around that time, that’s my guess

  22. Flavor said, on June 14, 2020 at 5:17 pm

    powerful ad

  23. Flavor said, on June 14, 2020 at 5:46 pm

    fuckin gamer

  24. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 6:31 pm

    wow nice shot of Sosa’s home turf in San Pedro de Macoris.

  25. zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 6:38 pm

    San Dawg gets the win! Well done!
    Grand Canyon, starring Kevin Kline, Danny Glover, and Steve Martin.
    The term Grand Canyon is used as a metaphor for racial division and economic division, and if things can change.
    Great film!

    • zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 6:41 pm

      • zumiee said, on June 14, 2020 at 6:42 pm

        Steve Martin did very well in a dramatic role.

  26. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:14 pm

    G Hill there in on deck circle for Cubs.
    Royce Clayton was Cards SS that year too.

  27. alleykat69 said, on June 14, 2020 at 7:22 pm

    I was watching some of the longest bombs.
    G Hill &Dave Kingman have a couple of the big
    ones at Wrigley at an estimated 503 for Hill and 530 for Kingman
    as the ball landed past the 3rd house on Waverly Blvd..

    • willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:03 pm

      wow. didn’t realize G Hill was local guy too, drafted out of Santa Cruz HS.
      Was that Beck getting last out as Cubs clinched playoff 1998?

  28. willedav said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:11 pm

    Beck signed as FA with Cubs and had 51 saves for them in 1998, his last really good season.
    Cubs got in as the WC, eventually lost to Braves who in turn were eliminated by Padres managed by Bochy for NL pennant. Yanks swept them in WS.

  29. xoot said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:23 pm

    I remember the one-game playoff at the end of the 98. iirc, Bonds flied out against Beck in the 9th and the tv feed showed him shaking his head wearily at Dusty Baker as he reached the dugout. At least that’s the way I remember it. The Giants were exhausted at the end of that regular season. Flying to Chicago didn’t help. iirc.

    • xoot said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:28 pm

      I checked. My memory’s bad. Barry hit a deep sac fly against Mulholland. Then Beck came in and finished the game for Chicago. I do remember that weary shake of the head, though.

    • Macdog said, on June 14, 2020 at 8:58 pm

      I remember being PO’d that the Giants were getting no-hit pretty deep into the game.

  30. blade3colorado said, on June 14, 2020 at 9:28 pm

    Trump says Biden looks frail? Huh? Trump looks like a 90 year old man walking down this ramp.


    • Macdog said, on June 14, 2020 at 9:36 pm


      • blade3colorado said, on June 15, 2020 at 7:40 am

        Good one Mac (what snarkk said about him holding his glass and his “gait.”). lqtm

    • snarkk said, on June 14, 2020 at 11:29 pm

      Earlier in that speech, he slurred words, and he needed two hands to shakily lift a water glass for a drink.
      He’s getting hammered with insults on social media. You reap what you sew…

      • blade3colorado said, on June 15, 2020 at 7:41 am

        I hope the fool chokes to death while he’s scarfing down one of those Big Mac cheeseburgers. Poetic!

  31. zumiee said, on June 15, 2020 at 6:28 am

    The ‘98 one-game playoff loss, at the time, just seemed like typical Giants, always blowing it in the playoffs.

    • Carstie Clausen said, on June 15, 2020 at 8:12 am

      Except in 10, 12 & 14.. That first one, down to the Reds two-zip in SF and then sweeping them in Cincinnati changed all those previous floppolas. Can you say magic?

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