A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball

Who Plays And Who Does Not

Posted in Uncategorized by Flavor on July 9, 2020

I’m hoping Buster is away from the team because he’s deciding whether or not to opt out of the season—something I completely support him doing by the way. If it’s a actual family emergency that would be terrible.

Belt is now in a walking boot due to a bum heel so he’s right on target with expectations this season….

Hey, if all these aged played can’t/don’t play we might get our wish of seeing a genuine youth movement this  “season”.

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  1. alleykat69 said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:20 am

    I’d be all in playing The youngsters.Speaking of the youngsters Marco Luciano only 19 in September has many a scout drooling in all of baseball as they’re rating him as high as top 5 prospect in all of baseball come next season!
    They show him hitting a long Bomb in batting practice recently and the sound off of the bat is “MLB Quality Thumping”!! 🙌🔥
    Kapler says his young guys ..Canário,Ramos,Luciano,Bart,Bailey,and Bishop( once he fully recovers) are making Oracle Park look small…

  2. willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:24 am

    well, Belt being out likely opens up more secure spot for Ruf, who will turn 34 July 28. If Flores plays more 1b, then either Sandoval (who has also played there) or Solano (2b/SS/3b), both in their 30s, would be more secure.
    Now Craw or Longo being out, different story altogether.

    No Posey means bunch of Kratz types behind plate, who suck at whatever age. The 2 they had in before Heinemann and Brantly, are either light hitting back ups or career minors guys without ML experience.
    I’d be really surprised they just hand job to Bart right out of the gate, right or wrong.

    • Flavor said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:40 am

      even if they did give Ruf a shot he would either have to produce or they’d ditch him nearly immediately. He wouldn’t get the nonsensical run that a guy like Belt gets. And if Ruf was able to translate his overseas success to here, why not right? Go Ruf.

      • willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:45 am

        sure, why not. He raked in ST and even at DH would likely be more productive than Pence. Just don’t see SF dumping the old guys was gist of what I was trying to say.

  3. willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:28 am

    Again, right or wrong, word from Z Kap Harris is Giants are fully into contending and putting best team out there. Get off to a hot start in short season where anything can happen yada yada

  4. alleykat69 said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:49 am

    You guys know if for some reason Mookie Betts decides not to play in the race to 60, he has another sport he could pickup some loose change in and that’s the Professional Bowling League.He’s won a charity tournament, threw a 300 game.Nice to have that option in this crazy year of sports..

  5. willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:50 am

    From what I read as far as projections for Ws necessary to get into NL playoffs 32 seems to be minimum. Lot of competition especially in NL Central for who wins divisions. Giants were slotted I think for 27-28, so optimistically it’s only 4-5 games you need to pull out of fire to be in discussion. And Harris talking about possibility Giants could be in position to add players, not sell them off, with fast start.

  6. willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:55 am

    I read through @extrabaggs tweets and he said he hasn’t spotted BHam yet. hmmnn

  7. chipower9 said, on July 9, 2020 at 8:12 am

    Agree Flav, and hope re: Buster it is him just contemplating whether to play, or not. And I too absolutely support any of these guys who have no desire to play in the current situation. If it is truly a personal family matter, then I wish the Posey family all the best.

    I really don’t care who gets in the mix, or not. Truly at this point I am just hopeful that they get the season started and we get to see some ball. With that said, I would love to see as much as possible of the young ‘uns.

  8. Winder said, on July 9, 2020 at 8:31 am

    The way it looks so far is most of the players will be in on a part time basis not just the pitchers. If that’s the case we will see just how Kap looks. i like the philosophy of everybody plays. If the season does take off I think we got a chance to see some playoff games.

  9. Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 8:40 am

    Back, back, back. We need to go back three years, or possibly two. Reason the team is in their current state is largely due to the World Championship successes in ’10, ’12 and ’14. It was like dancing with the gal you brung to the ball. LOYALTY. In a sense loyalty is totally a wonderful trait. But it was loyalty to the players who brought us to that string of flags that befogged forward-thinking within the previous brain-trust–whom some on the site transformed into “train-bust”.

    Had the Giants traded off some of their key pieces in ’17 and ’18 to preferably AL teams jonesing for the big brass ring, matters would be looking very rosy in ’21. Hindsight, for sure, but some times hjardnosing it is the way to go. It would seem that the hiring of Zaidi came as recognition that there was need for a clean slate. Ditto, the retirement of Bochy and hiring of Kapler.

    But history is history and focus must be directed towards a more sustainable future. True, it would be tempting to make a run for it this season, but let’s get real. It may be an even year, but we’re not in the Teens anymore, Toto. When the trade-winds start whistling in our ears and with several teams in the hunt, the Giants have some tested veteran spare-parts which could be transformed into another burst of magic in an even year: 2022.

    • chipower9 said, on July 9, 2020 at 9:56 am

      I see it both way, Stix. With the weird-ass 60 game slate, truly anything could happen. The Giants could catch fire out of the gate, and truly have a chance at the post-season dance (if the season gets started and progresses to that point). I have read multiple stories where if that happens, the Giants could be in the “buy mode.”

      The thing with most of our vets is that many have full no-trade clauses.

      Cueto is owed 21 mil in ’21, and 22 is a club option (5 mil buyout).

      Samardzija may be good trade bait (he is a FA after this year and owed 18 mil this year). Not sure how much he would bring…alot depends on how he does this year.

      Belt is owed 16 this year and next. Limited trade clause where he can block trades to 10 teams (not sure which teams).

      Craw is owed 15 this year and next. Full no-trade clause.

      Longo is signed through ’22 with an option for ’23. 15 mil this year, then 18.5 and 19.5 in ’21 and ’22. Option is at 13 mil with a 5 mil buyout.

      So, a lot is going to depend on how the Giants do early, and how the vets perform.

      I would love to see them dump some of the vets and get something viable in return, but I’m not holding my breath. Right now, I just want to see them play some ball, and sort all that shit out on the backside.

  10. alleykat69 said, on July 9, 2020 at 9:42 am

    Giants do have one of the toughest schedules coming out of the gate.
    Of the 1st 36 games they have 10 with the Dodgers,3 with the A’s, 3 with Trashstros,10 with the D-backs etc.then it gets alittle softer.But if they can’t holdup early on, look for them to deal established pitchers at the Aug31 trade deadline..Likely to move on are Shark,Watson,Gausman &Smyley and hope to pickup a prospect are 2 like they did to get Dubon&Davis last year..

  11. Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 9:58 am

    As Giants fan-atics, we could use a little heart-warming. Right? Check this out. Guy was ready to hang up his spikes after seven years in the pipeline, where the best he could manage was an averaged 82.4 mph fastball. No wonder he didn’t get the call. During those long summers in the minors his average ERA was 2.52–not exactly shabby in any league. But a slew of fireballers got the call to The Show while he had only hope to keep on going.

    Then it happened. “Pack your bags for San Francisco.” On the 8th of August last year his first appearance on the mound for the Giants began with his first sling being an 83 mph fastball. Swing and miss. Second was virtually identical. Tap-out to shortstop, 6-3. During the remainder of the season, the not so kid any longer was one of the stingiest hurlers in MLB, where batters managed a .185 BA against the lanky right-hander with nary a single long-ball. His 70% ground-ball rate was 3rd in MLB last year. His 1.02 ERA got em all talking.

    So who ARE we talking about? Name is Tyler Rogers. His twin brother Taylor got the plus genes. He’s a southpaw fireballer and is currently the 9th inning man for the Twins. So why didn’t Tyler get the call one helluva lot earlier? See, he’s one of those rare commodities in the game–a submariner–in fact, probably the most extreme low-baller in MLB history. Stolid and stodgy scouts, coachers and managers could not wrap that one around their grey-matter. When your fastball tops out in the low 80’s, how they gonna rate you?

    You go back to Kent Tekulve for the Pirates and Dan Quisenberry for the Royals, both slingers rather than hurlers. Both of them were highly successful closers. But neither of those stars threw as much of a stinker of a sinker as Rogers. He comes at ya down and dirty. You would think that some savvy team would have landed Rogers on a Rule-Five. Didn’t happen.

    With the change in upper management philosophy ,somebody decided to make the “cup of coffee” call. Why not give the guy a chance? After all, in that 7 year MiLB career, Rogers’ 2.52 composite ERA was ninth best in the minors during that span. Back before I got taken down in August of ’16 I was thinking that Rogers would get the call in September. As somewhat of a pipeline stats junkie, I’d been eyeing the numbers. But stolid and stodgy baseball traditionalism ruled the day in 16, and in ’17, and ’18 until Mr Z. started calling the shots. Shake it up. Try something different. Take a chance. Even Bochy, finishing out a generally brilliant managerial career as a pitching selector must have figured “what the heck, season’s shot to hell anyway and I’m getting some pressure to check him out.”

    Was skating through the pizza-menu on MLB’s site after hitting the Flap and saw this headline: “Who’ll get the ball in the Ninth Inning?” Yup. Figured it had to be Rogers. Sure enough. Dan Kelly, a writer/analyst working outta New York, assembled a superb piece of research on submariners, with yet a second headliner for Rogers: “Why this Submariner could reach Great Heights.” He buttressed his call with some quotes from Gabe Kapler (did read that link) who rather strongly hinted that the hottest closer you never heard about would fill that role for the team.

    Curiously, the non-fireballing twin and his brother Taylor are descended from a long line of fire-fighters and had Tyler not got the call last year he was strongly considering the family tradition as his next move. Could be Giants fans will be glad that Rogers finally got his due–and if he is not chosen as the closer, maybe Kapler would be open to a a reprise I’ve been hollering about for years on this blog: To resurrect the FIREMAN, the guy who comes in during the fifth or sixth inning to face jammed bases replacing a starter running on fumes. Again, for those who didn’t catch my screeds on that subject, during the Fifties, Sixties and slightly into the Seventies, the fireman was considered more critical as a go-to guy than the closer. Either way, dousing the flames, or shutting em down in their last shot, Tyler Rogers just possibly could become the man described by Christy Mathewson’s book title: “Pitching in a Pinch.”

    • djloo27 said, on July 9, 2020 at 10:56 am

      The truest submariner I ever saw:

      • unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:23 am

        Looks like Krukow’s long-lost brother.

      • willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:37 am

        yeah first one I remember seeing throw that way.

  12. Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 10:02 am

    Sorry. Obsessed with 8th of August for some unaccountable reason. Correct date for Rogers’ first appearance for SF was 8-27-19.

  13. Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 10:19 am

    Just now checked out MLB trade rumors to read that G.M. Scott Harris is holding the line with Zaidi, claiming that a fast-start would keep SF in the chase. Could happen, but don’t hold your breath. First, what is it, seven games
    are at the LAtrine and the Snakepit. Tough venues for a team assembled from a composite of spare-parts. Don’t be shocked outta your shorts if they start out 2-5. I’d frankly be fairly satisfied if they manage a 3-4 record starting out.

    Baseball is a funny game, though. Excepting for games where you gotta face highly motivated ace pitchers, just about any MLB squad can beat most any opponent on any given game. There’s a lotta luck, chance and serendipity in baseball. That’s key to the magic of the once and future “National Pastime”. Sometimes spirit trumps talent. Whether it could run over 60 games getting us into the legendary “Miracle Mets” zone closing out the Sixties…

    One thing for sure, going into the season just about each and every manager and GM tends to put on a good face regarding their team’s chances. By mid-August we should know how it is for Los Gigantes.

  14. alleykat69 said, on July 9, 2020 at 10:35 am

    Well it would be a good day in the Oracle neighborhood if Mr.Rogers could lockdown the closer role Stix!
    Though with Kapler being new I could even see him going Lefty/Righty committee with Elementary Watson getting work in the role especially with his added experience..

    I’m still mystified on why that promising lookin kid from last year Jamirl Gustave is not on they’re roster.Did he have a run in with management are something?? Just can’t figure why he was excluded from a team that desperately need BP help..

    • Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:01 am

      Yeah, Kat. I’ve been wondering the same thing ever since Gustave didn’t make the cut. Haven’t yet heard of any official reason/excuse/cover-story. Fan-atics like we Flappers do not like to be kept in the dark.

  15. xoot said, on July 9, 2020 at 10:45 am

    If I read the injunction correctly, it says shut down the pipelines. Empty them. Fill your 60-man tank and go for it and let’s see if we can all make some money. Anything is possible. All sorts of wild ass things may occur. And no one knows what the minor league system will look like in 21. Much less 22.

    Based on recent events, can anyone else foresee this? A vet, say Evan Longoria, is in the lineup at 3B but removed at the last minute for what the Giants and mlb describe as problems related to his most recent test. What problems? Was it botched? Lost? Is he sick? Maybe we’ll hear later, but he’s not in the ballpark tonight and fill-in-the-blank is starting at 3B. And that’s only one of a thousand disruptions that might arise.

  16. snarkk said, on July 9, 2020 at 10:51 am

    With no fans in seats, I don’t see any major home field advantage anywhere in respect of these lopsided home/away schedules, other than SF where it is cold…

  17. alleykat69 said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:08 am

    Advantage now at Oracle goes to the seagulls!
    Hey a lot of the cardboard cutouts the fans can submit should be
    arms covering they’re heads with a frightening look 👀 kinda something
    out of Hitchcock’s “The Birds”.I could get into that as a swarm of seagulls attack a cardboard fan and carry him/ her away..

    • unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:25 am

      Right. Just cover the cardboard ‘fans’ in french fries, and let the hilarity ensue.

    • Bozo said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:26 am

      The seagulls might not come in if there isn’t any food to be found. If they don’t show up, the Giants should cut to a scene from the Birds though, I like that call. Oh yeah, and since they won’t be able to show fans eating garlic fries, will they just cut to Kuip chowing down the whole game?
      Kat, I hope each day you’re feeling better. You might want to keep an oil can handy just incase some parts get a little rusty.

  18. Bozo said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:35 am

    MLB just put out the 2021 schedule and the Giants open…on the road.

    • Bozo said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:35 am
    • Macdog said, on July 9, 2020 at 2:34 pm

      Great, more DH baseball to start the ’21 season.

  19. willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 11:48 am

    Stix, the sticking point to Giants getting rid of older underperforming players seems to be ownership’s unwillingness to send any payroll relief back with them. For whatever reason Z has been unable to convince them of benefits, such as saving at least few million and maybe increased value of prospect that comes back.

    Look at who they still have now, the guys Chi mentioned above, plus they added Pence and Sandoval back in. I mentioned Ruf above and he’ll be 34 in couple weeks. I like Solano but he’s on wrong side of 30 as well.The influx of young players so far is mostly in the OF as are most of the prospects other than Dubon.

    The rest of the young hitters like Luciano aren’t gonna be here for awhile, as in 2-3 full years. He was slated to start at Low A Augusta and then move up to San Jose. which won’t happen until 2021. At least if season is played some of these guys will see some action and work out for couple months.

    • willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 12:02 pm

      we talked about this a lot last season; some proposed deals had SF trading away one bad contract for another in an effort to move on and create opening.

    • chipower9 said, on July 9, 2020 at 6:40 pm

      Agree, Willedav – I meant to mention that in my post, that to dump some of the vets, the Giants would probably have to eat some salary. Not holding my breath…

  20. unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 12:00 pm

    My wish since the close of last year was losing Belt and Crawfish. That still hasn’t happened. Nothing that happens this year, short of 15 1st basemen getting hurt, will change that.

  21. alleykat69 said, on July 9, 2020 at 12:42 pm

    Thanks Bozo,
    Im feeling the hip barking today some.I might need to go something stronger then 3 in one oil lubricant on this hip.Also more oil on jaw and head area so I can get my smoke stack going as well off my funnel top..

    • snarkk said, on July 9, 2020 at 1:50 pm

      The snarkkmutt gets CBD dog biscuits and CBD oil in his food for his bad hips. Seems to help…

      • chipower9 said, on July 9, 2020 at 6:41 pm

        Our older Norwich gets CBD oil…seems to help.

    • xoot said, on July 9, 2020 at 2:04 pm

      I know quite a few aging, seriously athletic people who swear by CBD.

    • unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 3:00 pm

      A friend of mine made me some. He had so much left over weed that he didn’t know what to do with it. He made me a jar of CBD rub that he said was around $300.00 worth of pot. It is most excellent for my back and neck.

    • Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 3:09 pm

      Ooh, don’t I wish. At best it’s 123 days away for my sciatica. Meanwhile, sis, who’s had major back operations, is abed in this 84% level of humiliated relatives, prelim to another rainstorm sweeping through. “It’ hurts so bad.” Couldn’t quite convince her to access Minnesota’s chemicaled-up excuse for medical, to say nothing of CBD. Norskies can be bullheaded to a fault sometimes.

      Meanwhile, with the temps having dropped from low 90’s to low 70’s my heat-challenged brain reactivated and it was possible to do some editing work, dishwashing and reorganizing the space. Paperwork? There are probably a good 4 reams generated when I was down. It should be basically organized before the month is over, meaning that this machine may segue into transcription all that pen, pencil and paper stuff. Meanwhile, also needing to access an art-supply house online to get the Cosmographic Alphabet material into ready-copy state on good paper to get going on adult coloring-book production. Will also need to navigate Safari in order to get all of that ready for a printer.

      Personal epigenetic programming prefers cooler weather. A bunch of basking in the sun is not my idea of time invested. Get into your 70’s a bunch and time is MUCH better invested than spent.

      • unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 5:24 pm

        Stix, I’ve tried anything and everything with my back. Through a few car accidents, skiing crashes, golf, tennis, falling off buildings and piers, and 59.5 years of general mayhem, plus a horrific gardening accident, I have 2 compression fractures at L4 and L5, and a wiggly spine that never seems to be vertical.

        Chiropractic care seems to be the only thing that works for me. PT did nothing but make shit worse, drugs, mainly opioids, just make me feel stupid and in pain, but the CBD has been pretty good at calming things down when things get bad.

        Have you tried acupuncture? Friend of mine swears by it but I haven’t gone that route yet.

      • Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 6:17 pm

        Unca: Been all about going to acupuncture–checking out sites and such first. Problem Is that I’m still property of the B.O.P for those 123 days and need to jump through a maze of bureaucratic hoops even to access standard, minor allopathic medicine. Sometime in November I should be re-eligable for Minnesota Care, which is a fairly high-level state-amplified Medicare program. So in 20 weeks or less I may be able to check out the acupuncture route. Chinese have been utilizing it for a few thousand years, so if the practitioner knows what he/she is doing I wouldn’t be afraid to drop in

        Looks like you’ve been a bit more at it with your body than I have. Were I in your shoes I’d definitely try to find all about acupuncture that I could. Perhaps there is some internet site out there which features testimonials from folks who’ve taken that approach. Meanwhile, keep it up with the CBD and I’ll be joining you in that as soon as it becomes possible.

  22. xoot said, on July 9, 2020 at 1:49 pm

    This season just gets better and better.

    • snarkk said, on July 9, 2020 at 1:51 pm

      MLB ownership is so generous. Do these guys have to pay for their own masks?…

    • willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 2:51 pm

      taxi squad? The 30 guys who aren’t with big club all get their normal prorated salaries, correct?

      • willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 2:53 pm

        minimum salary is $500K, so prorated is say $175K, for 2 months work, no?

      • xoot said, on July 9, 2020 at 3:08 pm

        what do minor leaguers earn? peanuts. Although, everyone on the 40 gets some percentage of the mlb minimum (used to be 100% but I think that changed to some sort of sliding scale in the last cba). So you’ve got a lot of guys making peanuts on the 60. I think everyone in the 60 not on the mlb roster is on the taxi.

      • Carstie Clausen said, on July 9, 2020 at 3:15 pm

        Isn’t hot ironic when taxi-squad guys can’t individually afford a cab? If it could be properly publicized, a “Go Fund Me” site for the Sac-town thirty could possibly shame the organization’s poobahs into sparing some shekels. Now that Baggs stepped into some doo-doo, maybe he’d be up for a bit of personal atonement by splashing such a fan initiative.

      • xoot said, on July 9, 2020 at 3:19 pm

        well, only players on the 40s are members of the union. So, don’t hold your breath.

      • willedav said, on July 9, 2020 at 4:07 pm

        xoot I don’t think these are the typical guys that would be in San Jose rooming together or AA ball. the extra guys do include all the draftees, who did pretty well with bonuses. Anyone the Giants signed in off season like Sandoval or Yolmer Sanchez or others like Duggar and Slater would be there too.

      • xoot said, on July 9, 2020 at 4:48 pm

        but we know who they are. Will the lower non-40 20 be better off than if they were in low A ball or at San Jose? That’s an abstract question. This season is unique. Sui generis, as Loo might say. Minor leaguers not on the 40 make between $300 and $700 per week depending on the level. The added $18 per day as pandemic pay is just hilarious.

  23. xoot said, on July 9, 2020 at 3:28 pm

    why can’t we see all of this all the time? Makes no sense.

    • snarkk said, on July 9, 2020 at 5:21 pm

      That right and right center wall area definitely looks different and closer now…

      • djloo27 said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:24 pm

        I read that Belt didn’t notice the change at first…

      • alleykat69 said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:57 pm

        Loo.. Belt when he shows up to camp doesn’t give a rat’s ass about BP changes. He just wants to make sure the infirmary is up an running since he’s always leading the troops in injuries..

    • unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 5:29 pm

      Wish there was a view a little bit higher.

  24. zumiee said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:49 pm

    Posey is struggling with the prospect of playing the mini-season. And a player has to be mentally all-in to compete in the sport. I think Freeman struggling with the virus has rattled some players. As has been mentioned before, many of the players have very young children.

  25. zumiee said, on July 9, 2020 at 7:55 pm

    “Also on baseball’s new COVID-19 illness list are DJ LeMahieu of the Yankees, Charlie Blackmon of the Rockies, and Aaron Nola of the Phillies.”

  26. unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 8:55 pm

    The thing about COVID is someone who is otherwise healthy has a small chance of getting permanently damaged if not outright killed. Sure, 0.5% of 20 and 30 somethings getting permanent damage is small, but it is there. And if you are the one, like Freeman, well, there goes your career.

    And a lot of these guys have kids, so it is even more of a challenge.

  27. unca_chuck said, on July 9, 2020 at 8:57 pm

    You’d think a guy like Crawfish would be out with all his kids, and his sister’s kids as well.

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