Getting Back to Baseball…..
As was noted at the end of yesterday’s thread, the Red Sox signed Cody Ross to a 1 year, 3mill deal. Here’s what we know: Ross was initially seeking a 3 year deal. The Giants never made him a single offer. He expressed regret about that saying (and I’m paraphrasing here, I couldn’t find the article) “I’ll miss this place, I really wish they had made me an offer, I didn’t want to leave, etc…”
I think it’s obvious that Ross misjudged his market. But I think he landed in an outstanding spot to resurrect his career and maybe that’s why he took that deal and could have gotten more $ or an extra year somewhere else. Maybe. Between the dimensions of that park, getting to hit in the AL East and only 2 established outfielders (Crawford and Ellsbury) who both could get hurt filing their nails, I think he gets a lot of playing time in Boston this year and he will hit well. So maybe that’s it……
But jeez, he DID say he wanted to come back. He almost seemed sad to leave based on the comments that I was unable to locate (but paraphrased above). Pawlie Kokonuts suggested it was a pride thing and I could totally see that. I’m having a hard time thinking it was a $ issue. If you had told Sabean that he could have Ross for 1y/3m I would think he would jump on that and have no problem finding that in the budget. But who knows, I suppose it’s possible that the budget is rock solid at 130 million…..
Bozo the Clown DID get POTD recently for suggesting that Sabean do the very thing that the Red Sox did yesterday. Here it was:
“Bozo said, on January 18, 2012 at 7:15 am
Hey Blade, good job parking that car on the flowers.
I know it would just be a ST invite, but Gregor Blanco? Are you fucking kidding me.?
A shout out here to Bobby Evans, I don’t complain much and I do understand budget issues and all but Gregor Blanco? You see Bobby, I’m thinking maybe just maybe you can squeeze a few million from your ol’ pal Larry and perhaps pick up that clown wannabe, you know, Cody Ross. At this point you can probably get him on a one year deal and the Giant would then, truly have some OF depth. Don’t get me wrong Bobby, I love Nate and as exciting as a platoon of Huff, Belt and Pill would be I’m thinking adding a true OFer just might be some decent insurance to have.
Thanks in advance.
Bozo”
Now, I gave him POTD for 2 reasons: 1) I liked that it was in letter form to Evans and he ended it with a pleasant sign off 🙂 2) He made a very funny reference to Blade’s picture
I did not give him POTD for the Ross ref, I barely noticed it. I guess I didn’t even consider the fact that we could get him for 1y/3mil. And maybe we couldn’t. What he signed for with BoSox might not be what he would sign for with us. But did Sabes even consider it? I would like to think so. I’m hoping so. If he did I guess he passed on doing so after thoughtful consideration. Again, I have to assume he actually considered it. Ross wasn’t ever connected to a Red Sox rumor so I am assuming this developed recently. I would also assume that if it DID develop recently then there wasn’t anyone else out there making him a BETTER offer or he would have signed it already. But who knows, maybe he is just a very patient dude and this is exactly what he was looking for—a great opportunity to rebuild his career……..
All I know is that Justin Christian is our 5th outfielder right now and maybe our 4th OF if Belt starts the year in Fresno. There is also a dude named Gregor Blanco who is in the mix, at least in Spring Training. This does not secure my confidence in our outfield depth…..
Good luck to Cody in Boston this year. Like I said, I think he’ll do well. But I’ve got one piece of advice for Boston fans sitting along the 3rd baseline during Cody’s at bats: Duck!
A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball 
Aren’t they giving Burriss some time in OF as well?
We will have 5 bench payers right? Bench:
Backup catcher, Fontenot, Burriss and then it is either Huff at first with Belt and Pill as the other bench players. I still think Huff is playing half his starts in left and belt gets first base starts and Posey gets one or two a week.
Have a good week dudes, niner loss still hard to swallow…
Giant fans need to duck as well when Posey bats.He is right up there with Ross on bat tosses.
Football note…..The Giants were supposely targeting Kyle Williams due to his discloser of having concussions in the past.Football players need to STFU to the media, and not give another team any edge to use.Do like hockey players and just say BS its a lower body issue even when its totally something else…..
Burrissssssssssss in the OF? THAT makes me feel much better . . .
The Giants were targeting Williams for what? Hits? He catches punts, and they hit him. That’s the job description. I’m not sure what your post means.
What I don’t get is Williams’ dad saying Kyle had a separated shoulder. Did he get that during the game?
Don’t overreact, Burris be would like the 7th Ofer. And the litlle he’s played there he’s been fine.
Justin Chistian is not to the 5th outfielder. The team has indicated that it is most likely that the extra OFers will be Huff, Belt, Pill, and Burriss. GH is right. Certainly it’s it’s possible things could change but Tyler Graham is as much in the mix if Christian if Pill or Belt is sent down.I have no idea why Blanco is in camp, but I suppose he would be in the mix also, if Pill or Belt go down. But Christian is not currently under consideration to make the roster.
Baggarly guess on opening day rorster:
Rotation: Lincecum, Cain, Bumgarner, Vogelsong, Zito (with Surkamp the next line of defense).
Bullpen: Wilson, Affeldt, Romo, Lopez, Casilla, Mota, Runzler
Catchers: Posey, plus backup (either Hector Sanchez or Chris Stewart)
Infield: Huff, Freddy Sanchez, Crawford, Sandoval, Pill, Burriss, Belt, Fontenot
Outfield: Pagan, Cabrera, Schierholtz.
Ross had said he wanted a 3 year from the Giants but would accept a 2 year deal elsewhere
“…3-year deal to stay with S.F. at the start the offseason. When the Braves were rumored to have interest back in December, Dave O’brien of the Atlanta-Journal Constitution tweeted that he might accept a 2-year deal with other clubs.”
Doesn’t sound a like guy wanting to return.
From Baggs, Dec 7th:
“The Giants were definitely my No.1 choice,” said Ross, who had a long phone conversation with Manager Bruce Bochy earlier Wednesday. “I was looking at any possible scenario, any way, anyhow. Give them a hometown discount, whatever to help their payroll. But they would not commit to more than a year.
“It’s sad because I really wanted to come back. They never made me an offer.”
As I said, he clearly wanted to come back– he just misjudged the market as the 1 yr deal with Boston clearly indicates
I guess 14 HRS are not enough to be a Giant. Perhaps Ross will hit much better at Fenway with more consistent power.
He wanted three here but said he’d take two elsewhere. WTF would they even dream of offering 3 years? He’s being disingenuous saying he wanted to stay- he wanted to stay if they gave him 3 years…
What about that quote that YOU POSTED don’t you understand? He wanted 3 years at start of off season. No one game it to him. Then he says he’ll take 2. No one would give it to him . FINALLY HE HAD TO TAKE THE SINGLE YEAR OFFER. As I said HE MISJUDGED THE MARKET FOR HIS SERVICES. You fucking argue about everything just to argue. Go do that with Denny, he’s all amped up to argue about pro football, I had to alter 2 of his hangman posts from last night.
No, you pick fights. Maybe we can the review the night I was deemed to have picked a fight because I called Torres “Vungo”. You harrased me for hours. Don’t you ever compare me to Death Threat.
Now, let’s get this clear: Ross saying he wanted to come back it is completely disingenuous- he wanted back on a multiyear, they refused, and he never backed off wanting more more than one from us. The fact that he took 1 from Boston doesn’t mean he would have taken it here.
In the quote from Flavor, he’s clear that he was interested but not for one year. He says so.
“But they would not commit to more than a year.
“It’s sad because I really wanted to come back. They never made me an offer.”
He says that they would not commit to more one year so it’s fucking obvious they either made an offer or were prepared to but he wanted a multiyear deal..
In the quote I posted he said “they wouldn’t commit to more than one year.” What’s your point? Back then he still wanted a multi year deal. At first he wanted 3, then 2 now 1. Are you following along?
Are you? They wouldn’t give more a year and than and he *later* said he wanted three from us, 2 from anybody else.
Don’t fucking threaten me with “dismissal” again. I have a legit point and just because it doesn’t jive with yours you theaten with deletion AGAIN . Fuck that.
He wasn’t coming back here unless it was a multiyear deal. Do you have quote a showing he would? No..
Fuck you. Show me where I threatened you with deletion. Anywhere. Hello? Is this thing on? Stop lying and making shit up, I never threatened you once with dismissal or deletion.
I’d like to sign him for just Sept.
still waiting. Please identify a post today where I have threatened you with dismissal or deletion……
crickets chirping……
You fucking compare me with your alcoholic suicidal pal then talk about deleting his posts- why don’t you look “inference”. And shut the fuck with the “chirp” bullshit- you know that it takes me a long to post and edit these days. Stick that cricket up your ass.
I didn’t COMPARE you you dumbfuck, I said you could go argue with him. You do it all the time, I figured you’d relish in it. I referenced deleting his posts to show he is amped up and ready to go. He was over the top with his usual bullshit. I figured you’d love to take some shots at him, he’s an easy target.
NO WHERE DID i COMPARE YOU TO HIM UNLESS YOU’VE GOT A DEFINITION OF THE WORD
NO WHERE DID I THREATEN TO BAN YOU OR DELETE YOUR POSTS
THIS IS ALL IN YOUR FUCKING MIND……..
Can’t blame either side, and ross might have made a soft landing (tho sox fans will come down hard if he doesn’t produce). Ross OPS both of last two complete seasons have been less than .750, tho his explosion in late 2010 helped SF immensely. Sadly, he really didn’t do any better 2011 than he had for the Marlins in 2010 (and quite a downgrade from previous season), which is probably why he was available in the first place…and why he’s taking the type of contract he is now.
There’s tons of guys like this around, with good points and drawbacks, flashes and slumps, that put up league avg. numbers. Let’s hope the guys replacing him in the LU can do more.
“twinfan1 said, on January 24, 2012 at 10:51 am (Edit)
No, you pick fights. Maybe we can the review the night I was deemed to have picked a fight because I called Torres “Vungo”. You harrased me for hours. Don’t you ever compare me to Death Threat.
Now, let’s get this clear: Ross saying he wanted to come back it is completely disingenuous- he wanted back on a multiyear, they refused, and he never backed off wanting more more than one from us. The fact that he took 1 from Boston doesn’t mean he would have taken it here.”
FUCK THIS>>>>>
STFU about harrassing you for hours blah blah. I want you to show me where I said anything about dismissing you or deleting your posts or banning you or any of the FALSE bullshit you claimed above.
I told you to argue with Denny if you want to argue about something. That’s it. I pointed out that I deleted some of his pro football comments from last night and that he’s all amped up and ready to argue. You don’t want to do that?Fine, I don’t give a shit, I was just finding someone for you to argue with.
No where…NOFUCKINGWHERE did I threaten to dismiss you or threatened you with deletion…….
Stop making up lies………
As I said, you did it by inference . A tough concept, but whatever. Do it, don’t do it… You are FOS- we have a difference of opinion on Ross you say I’m picking fights. That’s bullshit. Meanwhle you post this ridiculous nonsense about Chrisitian- and the only reason you post it is to annoy. I wasn’t posting anything but a legit opinion, you need to find a awy to stop harrassing over opinons. Move along and harass someone else.
A common misperception among less informed observers is that if Ross, in this case, signed with Boston with at 3 million for one year, that we could have had him for that. Ross was not coming back here except for a multiyear deal- that never changed…
you are completely inferring this. There no evidence that he ever said this. What we do have is him discussing wanting a 3 year deal with the Giants. There is ZERO evidence that he was asking 3 from them but less from another club. When FA started he wanted 3. Then he dropped to 2. Then 1. It is common sense that he simply misjudged the market and watched the 3 of years offered to him drop and drop and drop.
He took the Boston deal cause that’s the best offer out there. End of story.
And I said *crickets chirping* because there was no fucking way you were gonna be able to find a post that threatened you with dismissal or deletion. It had nothing to do with your speed of typing.
the crickets will be chirping till the end of time of this because there is no such post that you can re-post that will back your bullshit claim that I threatened you with dismissal or deletion OR THAT EVER COMPARED YOU TO DENNIS. Go look up the definition of *compare* and get back to me if you still think I compared the two of you.
Giants OF is mildly better than last year, on paper. Certainly the overall speed on the bags, on paper, is better, and hitting production should be better, although they all have very little pop, which was and still is needed on this team. Maybe it’s enough to get them to the division win if none of them get hurt, and Posey and Franchez perform somewhere back towards “normal” at the plate. But, if anybody in the starting OF gets hurt for any length of time, this OF will be back to being pretty weak from an offensive perspective. I would feel a lot better offensively if they had gotten a guy like Willingham to really upgrade production. The Twins paid him $7M per for 3 years. He is a pull hitter to left, he could have excelled at ATT; that was a very doable contract IMO…
I watched Willingham in DC for a year–or parts of it. One of those guys who is constantly injured with something. But damn if he doesn’t produce. His percentage of hits to RBIs is always quite high, and he knows how to take a base on balls. Not pretty in the field however. Makes Beltran look nimble.
The back up outfielders would Huff and Belt if a couple guys go down. With Pill or Sandoval then manning first. I’m not seeing the OF “being pretty weak from an offensive perspective. ” In fact, offensively, it might be better.
According to Dave O’Brian of Atlanta Journal Constitution Ross wanted 3 from us because “of the picther friendly park”, but 2 from anybody else. I think he has a twitter account. Ask him if he’s lying.
Henry Schulman says Timmy has signed for 2 yrs, 40.5 m. (18m in ’12, 22m in ’13, 500K signing bonus)…
shit, I would’ve beat you to this scoop but I was too busy and intrigued reading the Flavor-Twin Ross War. I imagine no one has signed anything, just an agreement in principle. I’m sure glad we did not commit $100 million. For anyone. That’s just me. But it ain’t my money.
Timmy signed. 2 yrs, $40.5 mill.
I wish we could get @Love4PattheBat [Miss Erin] to come here. Ooooh la la. Fritters my Twitter.
They’re saying Prince may get a 9-yr deal with Detroit. Crazy.
Pure lunacy. He’s going to start going down hard and when he does it’s gonna happen super fast…
not bad, I think I was only 500K off the ultimate deal he signed……
Prediction for 2014: 67-95
Timmeh.
2 years for $40.5. It’s done.
He gone in 2014. Book it…
And we’ll have had his best years, and his next team his declining years. Book that.
And our window of opportunity to win another Series anytime soon under this billionaire’s club ownership will have vanished for the foreseeable future. Book that…
Yeah, having a sore armed “ace” throwing BP for 30 million a year is gonna win us a WS..
Him having a sore arm next week, next year, or in 5 years is pureass speculation. It might happen, it might not. For all we know, the Giants sign Cain for 6 years and he blows an elbow for Tommy John the next day (he had elbow issues last ST), and Lincecum goes on for a decade with nary a hangnail…
Baggs writes Cain is open to a “team friendly” deal around 5 yrs 85m. What a guy!
Think both sides were smart with the Tim deal. He’ll get his 8 yr 200m elsewhere if he pitches brilliantly for the next two yrs, but twinfan is probably right. We’ll have seen his best yrs.
Nothing’s for sure, but Tim should still be top notch at 29. I think they should’ve locked him up for at least 4 years if possible.
He didn’t want a four year deal. These two year and two more would have been fine. He wants 6 or 8 years as injury insurance.
The Detroit Tigers and slugger Prince Fielder are close to agreement on a nine-year deal worth $214 million, a source told ESPN.com’s Jerry Crasnick.
The thing is, he’d (Tim) go likely to a team like the Yankees, Red Sox, or Angels- teams that don’t a give shit if he flames out after a couple years if he helps deliver a WS or two first..
I don’t know if Ross would have signed that deal with SF and I don’t know if the Giants tried. At this point it doesn’t matter. As with Rent, I’ll wish him luck and many thanks for a wonderful ride in 2010.
Right now the Giants have possibly five guys that will have playing time at 1B. Huff, Posey and Panda will get time at 1B as will Belt and Pill if they make the club. We have no idea how Posey is going to respond going back behind the dish so he may need even more days at 1B than planned. I do think that either Huff or Belt will be traded after the Fielder deal goes down. And, yes I do think Huff is tradable (hello Milwaukee) and no I haven’t seen any rumors, it just makes sense to my ass, which all of this is blowing out of.
Wow….Just under 24mil for 9 freakin years for Fielder, well thats alot of DH work in the future for Fatso.Wonder if the owner through in a Pizza chain as well.
AK, sh*t for that amount Fielder can start his own Pizza chain.
Justin Christan will not make the team.Book that.
2 years, $40.5 mill for Timmy Jim franchise freak.
http://www.oregonlive.com/mlb/index.ssf/2012/01/tim_lincecum_agrees_to_2-year.html
We saw that Chuck, I’m just sorry for the youngsters, who will have to endure another 50+ year drought because we didn’t give Timmy 6 years..
Is it fair to say that Tim’s abbreviated deal is entirely due to Zito’s flop?
No.
How about partly?
It has a LOT to do with it…
Ahh, didn’t scroll back far enough.
DJ, Timmy turned down 5 years for $100 million.
The Giants do not want to go 6+ years with ANY pitcher. Even Matt Cain.
You sure about that 5 year offer, Chuck?
From Yahoo sports:
The latest word out of the Giants is that they offered a five-year, $100 million deal and Lincecum easily rejected it. Pitchers such as CC Sabathia, who received a five-year $122 million extension late in 2011, and Cliff Lee, who received a five-year $120 million deal prior to the 2011 season are not only older than Lincecum, I feel that he is on-par or perhaps more effective than either of these pitchers. Comparatively speaking, a five-year, $100 million deal to Lincecum may seem like a slap in the face.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ycn-10878983
With Timmy at $18M for this season and $22M for ’13, it sets his F.A. bar plenty high. In some ways it can benefit the Giants. Depends on level of performance over the coming season as to whether or not he will be able to maintain a commanding position for FA from ’14 on. If he has a kickass season this year and is at least in primary Cy contention again his value couldn’t be higher going into ’13.
Contrarily, should there be further slippage or basically running in place, then a lot of possible scenarios open up preceding his walk year, including the timeworn strategy of a trade for significant prospects. That too, though, depends one whole lot on the kinda team and finish the Giants show this year. Tim runs in place, shall we say, while Giants go deep into the Post-Season, or even host another parade and trading Timmy would be out of the picture.
Should the Giants cop a pair of NL pennants and one big parade and Timmy continues to strut his stuff , the SF Billionaires Club may have to outbid the competition to keep the fan-base from going ballistic.
Ah baseball. All those variables and uncertainties. Maybe that’s why we love it.
I would have and indeed did go along w/ that line of thinking until…until Pujols flew to L.A. If a guy like that follows the money, anyone can. Then again, how naive of me to think he’d pull a Jeter or Ripken and stay in STL. He got the WS ring [two] and left. Must’ve figured, nothing else to prove here. Adios, amigos.
Pawlie, I think your last part was spot on. Pujols had two rings in St. Louis, he was there a decade, LaRussa retired — all those things piled up to mean — WTF NOT go somewhere else and try something new? It’ll be an adventure, and if it blows — well, I got $250M reasons to still be happy. And, if I can help win a WS here, then my legacy just got pumped up another notch. It’s a win win regardless of what happens…
Just keep the turf green and the hotdogs hot and enjoy Timmy for two more years.
and the beer cold, most important
I’ll drink to that!
Or, a season and a half…
Jeff Passan from Yahoo sports, (who I normally cannot stand because he has a clear bias against the Giants because of some slight Bonds layed on him who-knows-how-long ago for who-knows-why), had and interesting article about the Padres trade of Mat Latos with 4 yrs of team control still available for a bunch of viable talent. I’d post the link, but I’m not sure how to do it. How many more yoars is Cain under control, and do you take a chance like that?
Cain is “outta control”- he is a FA after this year–
I love how you have noticed Passan’s bias. Not everyone does. And you’re right, it’s all Bonds related. Whether he got butt-hurt by him or he’s focusing all his venom about the Steroid Era on Bonds, he does not dig Barry Bonds or the Giants, lol……
Green hotdogs and hot turf?
Word is you were banned from the Splash, Nip. Say it ain’t so!
Nip could give a shit about the Splash, he knows who butters his bread. The Flap! 🙂
Ah, thanks for the info. Twinfan1
I will be having yet another surgery Feb. 3. Another craniotomy , this time with radiation seeds implanted. As usual, I’ll leave my phone if anyone wants to call. Maybe it’s best that we didn’t make the SB-the bedside TVs at UCSF are 12 inch black and whites..
What is this? The stone age?
agree with Chuck, what is up with the 12 inch black and whites? Shit, bring an iPad in there and you’re good to go……..
Regardless of our earlier girl-fight, I am 100% supportive of your surgeries ending successfully, should you decide to do them. If you made the call to do this then it ws the right call, end of story. Remember what I said. “3 for 3? You’re good to go, Will Clark went 4 for 4 all the time.” Go nail it.
About the Giants getting Lincecum’s best years, I heard on the radio that the dude doesn’t ice after he pitches. I was so amazed to hear this that I checked on it. It seems to be true. That is really dumb.
I used to manage an orthopedic rehab clinic, and part of my job was QC, so I reviewed the literature on the modalities. Icing joints following stress isn’t some sports voodoo or old wives’ tale, it’s freaking science. Icing immediately after joint stress is THE NUMBER ONE way of keeping joints healthy. Period.
If Lincecum hasn’t been, and still doesn’t, ice after starts, I wouldn’t pay him a dime for anything longer than a one year contract when he is in his thirties. Lincecum has been epically stupid if this is really true – he has possibly taken years off of his career.
Where ya been? Great post. I wouldn’t spend other people’s $ on signing Timmy to a long term deal. There are 59 reasons why, maybe more.
Three things took me back to lurker mode. First was the fact that I got into it with twin over the penn state stuff. I have thick skin, but I also have a lot of respect for twin, and decided that I needed to shut up for a while. Secondly, football season has been at the front of the news, and the Giants haven’t, so there hasn’t been much of interest for me. Third, the holidays and the family kept me busy, not much extra time for internet gabbing.
About Lincecum, I am not sure if there are really that many reasons not to lock him up long term. He really is a freak of nature. For instance, strength and flexibility are inversely correlated to a very high degree. You either get one or the other, almost always. But Timmy has both. He is also rare mentally. For whatever reason, he can perform under pressure. His combination of mental and physical gifts would warrant a contractual gamble, in my view.
But he has been dumb about his diet and taking care of his joints (heh, I said joints). If you don’t eat right and ice after a start, there really is a cost in connective tissue that occurs. I would not wanting to be paying Tim when the bill comes due. I think that two years for a twenty eight year old who has been reckless in taking care of his body is the very edge of the risk envelope.