Happy July 4th
Yesterday morning at work, a buddy of mine asked me “As a Giants fan, when do you guys wave the white flag and become sellers? When do you decide it’s just not going to happen? 12 games out?”
I blurted out, “No, they can come back from 12 games out.” And then I thought about it and said, “It’s not really about how many games out they are. I mean, sure, at some point they will be eliminated mathematically. But for me, it’s always been how do I feel about the players on the team. Are they the right guys or not. Does the current collection of guys make up a team that will compete?”
In 2007 and 2008 I didn’t even need to see a game get played, I knew they were going to suck and I said so at the Splash before the beginning of each of those seasons. Before the 2009 season, i correctly identified that they would win 88 games, exactly. When the Dodgers added A-Goner, Beckett etc…. last August I scoffed at the trade and declared they wouldn’t win in 2012…..
This year, we brought back essentially the same team to win the world series. We did the same thing in 2011 so I knew the possible problems that this would create. But I still thought this team would do well this year and compete for a title the same way I thought the 2011 team would. This is clearly not going the way I had expected it to go in 2013. But as I look at the collection of players we have I still see a team that should compete this year, provided that we fill a couple of holes at the break. I think it’s now clear we need a starting LF. Blanco and Torres are fine #4’s but that’s it. Who will be *this year’s Hunter Pence*?
After that fictional add, I still feel we need either a stud set up man or a starting pitcher. Before Crain got hurt I wanted to acquire him and Rios. Now, I want to acquire Rios and Peavy. Both are owed 13 or 14 mil next year and that’s fine since we will need their services next year, too. There’s a risk with Peavy’s health but there’s always going to be a risk in a trade.
I’m not getting into who we give up to make that happen. I’ll leave that to Sabean. The price shouldn’t be exorbitant since we’d be taking on so much salary. But if a deal like that goes down, I don’t really care what the team is doing right now or how many games out we are today or tomorrow or next week. If it happens, I will believe firmly that we will fight to the end of this season for the NL West crown.
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Just win a game! GO GIANTS!
Happy Independence Day Flavor and all you Flappers. Excellent thread, Flav.
I’m not sure about a “magic number” of games back that constitutes becoming sellers. But given where the team is right now, I don’t think we’re even close. With almost half the season left in the Sucktitude Division, anyone can win the West.
You all know where I stand on this (add a starter, possibly a bullpen piece, and as more time goes along, I see the need for an OFer). I think the OF situation is becoming more and more of an issue. I have bagged on Andres this year, and Blanco deserves some too, but I think that is because, as you say Flav they are #4s, at best.
I like getting a starter that would be beyond a rental (I agree, we will need one next year, and I’m not sure any of the young slingers in the minors will be ready). There are a couple of guys in the BP with whom I have little confidence, so a reliever would definitely be in order.
And I have been calling for a starter for over a month. No guarantee that Vogey comes back to be a productive piece of the rotation, and they need a quality starter there (that will also put Gaudin back in the pen where I believe he best serves the team).
I am bummed and frustrated about their play, but no way are they close to being sellers, nor am I anywhere near looking for a ledge.
Anyway, I hope you all have a fun and safe 4th. GO GIANTS!
Here is a link re: Pablo. We all know how badly he has sucked of late, but this points out that he, Crawford, and Blanco are a combined 1 for 73. Wow…I knew we had guys scuffling, but I just had never really zoned-in on the numbers.
The bats, you would think, must come around eventually. This same damned team were leaders in many offensive categories for a chunk of the year, so I have confidence that they eventually break through (hopefully that happens before they are double-digits back).
The story also talks about could/would they option Pablo to Fresneck (that ain’t happenin’).
http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/andrew-baggarly/could-giants-option-pablo-sandoval-triple-fresno
Focusing on the platoon, or Perez, or the back up catchers..these are red herrings- this is about the the guys who were expected to be the run producers. In particular, Panda and Pence have to hit. As to Rios, I think Sabean will make a decision on who he wants for next year- go after Pence or add a Rios.. I don’t see him with a 36 million dollar OF, not with what’s happened with Pagan.
What can change everything is the status of the walking wounded- Pablo ( elbow, foot, weight), Scooter ( back, finger), Crawford (fingers). How much are their injuries afflecting their production? We have TWO RBI between them in over 2 weeks. The upcoming homestand should provide some answers…
Gametime Forecast: 70°F • Light Rain • 49%PoP
1. Gregor Blanco (L) CF
2. Tony Abreu (S) 2B
3. Pablo Sandoval (S) 3B
4. Hunter Pence (R) RF
5. Brandon Belt (L) 1B
6. Andres Torres (S) LF
7. Brandon Crawford (L) SS
8. Guillermo Quiroz (R) C
9. Matt Cain (R) P
If we do get another OFer, which I’m not against, he’s not going to make Torres and Blanco go away- they’ll still be here- either platooning as before or one taking over LF or CF. I wouldn’t be counting on the return of Pagan…
BTW, going by who was swinging the bat best in the Reds series, Bochy errred in the double switch- he should have pulled Crawford, not Torres. We got Perez and Crawford instead of Arias and Torres- big time blunder.
No one has said Torres and Blanco should or will go away. They should be platooning for each other. Both of them in the starting lineup together isn’t going to work. That would be conceding the season, IMO. The Giants have to roll the dice on something.
They’re not the problem- Panda, Pence, Scooter, Crawdad not hitting is the problem. And the pitching is still well off last year. Putting it on Torres/Blanco is absurd, IMO. Forgetitng Crawford, if 3 of the 4 two thru five hitters are aren’t hitting, we ain’t scoring.
What team has 8 starting position players who are top tier guys? Fact is, Torrres and Blanco are performing as well or better than expected- Pagan wasn’t, Pablo, Scooter, Crawford , and Pence aren’t. And 3/5th of the starting 5 pitchers who opened the season are hurt or sucking. I’m not saying that it’s ideal that Torres and Blanco are both starting but they won’t be the reason if we don’t make the postseason.
I have bagged on Torres (you cannot deny the string of errors he made during a rough stretch there), and Blanco has cooled. I, like Zumie, am not saying they should go away. I am just saying what I have been saying for a month-plus (and what Zumie mentions, too), that they should be options to platoon…not starting on a regular basis.
And I never said they were the crux of the problem, but they certainly have not been (nor are they) the answer to the OF problems.
Besides Buster, hardly ANYONE is carrying their weight. I would hope with what the line-up did earlier in the year, that most of them can turn it around and start hitting the way they should.
Neither has been worse than Pagan was and we can win with them. Of course I remember Yungo’s errors, perhaps you don’t remember Pagan’s errors, misreads, balls falling in because he plays too deep, etc. I also know that Andres is and was an excellent defender as he’s shown. As far as what Z mentioned, he actually bitched about Blanco’s performance when he was hitting over .340 over his past 4 weeks. Even AFTER his slump he’s well ahead of Pagan’s numbers, not to mention being a vastly superior defender. It’s isn’t just me, Baggs and others recognize that defensively Pagan is our 4th best CFer. I’m not so sure he’s not the 5th best…
I do love this practice of ignoring the numbers as is done with Pagan, I just think one shouldn’t do it selectively.
It’s a Red Schoendienst, Bill White and Vida Blue day! Have a great Fourth of July everyone!
Very good…let’s hear it for the Red, White and Blue!
BF, on a previous topic, surely you would agree that it’s unfair to compare athletes of different eras. How many games would the Packers of the ’60s win in today’s NFL? It’s possible those Packer teams would go 0-16 in today’s NFL, yet those guys were awesome in their era, and deserve respect for that.
And I would agree with Snarkk that you could pull certain individual players from the earlier eras in baseball and they would do well today.
I’ve never doubted their awesomeness in the eras they played in. I just think today’s athlete would destroy them. Just my opinion, I might be totally wrong and we’ll never know the answer since they can’t play against each other.
Of course if the football players of the 60’s had the same “benefits” that today’s guys have, they might very well be competitive. I’d guess that a 6 foot 9 inch 325 pound Bob St. Clair would be a pretty awesome dude protecting CK…
What’s on the menu? Red Hots on the grill, red potato salad, ripe red tomatoes, and some cold Sam Adams Irish Reds. That’s right, we’re feasting on the fucking Reds today (weather permitting). Go Giants!
I think the kids and I will take my 86 year old parents to a steak house. My parents always have salmon and halibut. The kids and I, being Giants fans, will have red meat.
Hi, fellas, what is going on?
day game rain-out? shite
MIA offense. double shite
cloud the dogers, mets, padres be a slump breaking run up to the ASB?
I have a hard time staying up on the baseball news, when does the July trading show start?
An interesting question: if we do fall out of the race would the Giants ever become sellers? Just because you aren’t a buyer doesn’t mean you have to be a seller. And if I’m not mistaken, I can’t recall a time where Sabean actually sold something for prospects at the deadline. I could be totally wrongo about this but I can’t remember him ever doing it.
I mentioned that when Brian asked about selling- they may not buy if they’re out of it, but they won’t be selling… you said it- this is a team maybe needing a piece or two, not an overhaul.
I don’t recall Sabean ever being a seller at the deadline for prospects, either. Anyone recollect differently?
The only thing that comes to mind is when he dealt Ray Durham for, I think Ford?
nothing’s on our menu today. Headed to a big block party with my daughter. It includes a jumpy house and a zip-line thing for her and kegs of beer and a big bbq for me. Should be fun.
Sounds like fun. Enjoy BF…
From Henry and Baggs:
“Well done, Barry Zito. He is donating $500 for every MLB strikeout today to Welcome Back Vets. It’s a tribute to late father, Joe.”
That is very cool. Zito has always been active in causes for the vets. Admirable.
What’s the outlook on the game today, are they saying when it might start?
They’re talking like they’ll try to play even if it starts tonight.
It will be called off. Just too much rain. Of course it will have to be made up.
this is one of those situations where twitter comes in handy:
https://twitter.com/sfgiants
If it isn’t, this should be the Twitter official song. It’s such a silly but happy tune.
Here is an hourly forecast for Cincy. Looks like there may be some breaks later in the afternoon and evening.
http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/cincinnati-oh/45212/hourly-weather-forecast/350126
Thanks guys, gives me chance to go do other things. I try not to miss a game here.
This sucks whether they play or not because they have to fly home late.now…can’t catch a friggin break
It’s postponed, they’re goin’ home.
good. Better for the Giants.
Absolutely. Cain and MadBum now go tomorrow and Saturday.
Marty Lurie was discussing who the Giants would sell if they became sellers. The only name that everyone seemed to agree with was “Lincecum”. I don’t see it.
If he pitches decently the rest of the way and remains in the rotation, I can see Tim staying here with a one year deal in an attempt to rebuild his value. I’m not saying that will happen, but I think it would be reasonable for all concerned.
He’s gone whether traded in 3 weeks or FA after the season. He’s heading home for the Mariners in 2014, starter or reliever…
That’s your opinion, yes. From his perspective financially, my scenario is far better for him, however. If he tanks the rest of the year, who cares what the eff he does, we’re getting nothing.
Tim has gross career earnings of $64 million. He’s got two rings. He doesn’t need the Giants anymore. Your scenario guarantees him nothing. He could crater in a one year deal, then he’s really toast. Mariners will pay him well for a multi year deal, and he’s back home with his buddies, where he wants to be…
I would tend to agree more with Michael, here. snarkk, And do you know something that we don’t re: your comment: “Mariners will pay him well for a multi year deal, and he’s back home with his buddies, where he wants to be…”?
Everything I have heard Tim say leans more towards him being open to staying with SF.
Agree with Michael that if he tanks rest of the way…it all really does not matter.
PPD great news .
No hopefully the Rockies Bums play 16
The rain gods saved the Giants from another loss. Fly home and remove the tail from between the legs. This team needs to start scoring early and stop pressurizing the pitching from the get go. If they suck for the next 3 weeks and are 10 under .500 or something at the trade deadline, I WOULD trade Tim because he’s gone next season. Get a couple of OF prospects that can hit. Otherwise, I would do nothing. They have nothing to sell otherwise, unless they want to trade Panda now before he gets to 300#. Save the pitcher prospects for next year, and grab a FA pitcher in the offseason. Go from there. If they right the ship the next three weeks, then OK, pick up a starter or a LFer, no more…
Trading Lincecum before the deadline makes no sense whatsoever. “Get a couple of OF prospects that can hit” . We wouldn’t get a couple of OF prospects who *can’t* hit. He’s our #3 right now, get either a legit one (Lee) or a legit 3 ( Gallardo, Norris) and we’ll be fine once Panda and Pence start hitting- which they will ( unless Panda’s elbow is the problem).
As far as Posey, he’s not a good first baseman, why would he be good at third? Playing it in college is not much of a barometer. Sorry to say but if he doesn’t catch, LF is probably his best position.
Panda? I can see them trading him for sure. There’s nobody in the system or in free agency who will improve the position so they need to get improvement elsewhere in the deal.
IMO.
Maybe not improve the position if you are talking Panda when he was excelling in the field and hitting the cover off the ball. But how long has it been since we’ve seen “that” Panda, and do you think we’ll ever see him again?
Dominguez in Fresneck may be a serviceable replacement for Pablo. He isn’t sucking by any stretch:
.331 .OBP, 507 SLG, .296 AVG, .837 OPS. 10 dingers and only four errors.
And what about Monell in Fresneck as a replacement for Posey? His caught stealing percentage isn’t great, but otherwise, his numbers are not too shabby.
Check out the Fresno numbers of some others who we all begged for at one time or another and then get back to me on Chris. As far as Panda, Chi- you wanted him replaced for the World Series…
.
Lurie actually had a decent idea IMO. Trade Panda in the offseason for good prospects or a starter, move Posey to third, Belt stays at first. All predicated on getting, somehow, a decent catcher. I haven’t looked at the FA catcher list. A little bit out there, but at some point Posey’s not catching anymore, they’re babying him now with these stupid moves where Belt sits against LHPs, so why not?…
Sure, that’s reasonable.
Regarding Timmy, Lurie thinks he can get 4years/$68 mil. Seems possible I guess
Seems high to me, but I never underestimate the idiocy of MLB ownership. I think he needs a change of scenery, different coaches. Maybe somebody else can help him with fastball command. Rags and Gardner obviously can’t/haven’t. I still think he’s headed to be a Pen guy. He could make good coin doing that for another 5-7 years. By then, he’d be up to around and above $100 million in career earnings, that’s not a bad career. Buys a lot of weed, especially where its legal in Washington state…
Snarkk thinks he’ll end up a reliever. No one will pay an virtually untested reliever that kind of money. And he wouldn’t be a closer. As a reliever he’d get squat. His only hope for 4/68 is finishing this year like CY or signing for one year here or elsewhere and rebuilding his “brand”. IMO.
Happy 4th, Flappers.
I’m off to start prepping for a minor home-made burger bash here at the Snarkkpit.
Then off to an evening outdoor kids’ dance performance including Snarkkette #2, followed by fireworks. Stay cool…
It’s been 110 to 115 all week here, Absolutely miserable. I tried to start smoking the ribs outside and I almost passed out. No wonder all the great pit bosses are mean bastards… so it’s oven BBQ. Dr. T made a blackberry pie and there’s pintos, cole slaw, potato salad, lemon meringue pie, and watermelon. We’ll survive.
Sounds awesome…too bad it is too not to smoke the ribs…nothing like smoked meats! Do you do a rub, sauce, both?
I do a rub based on the old LBJ ranch recipe, and a “mop sauce” which seems to be best when it tastes absolutely vile. Somehow it makes the ribs taste anything but vile. Black coffee, vinegar, “wooster sauce”, hot sauce, beef broth, garlic, bay, dry mustard, and much more…
The “table sauce” is the least important part of it, IMO. I should have done the ribs outside last night. If there’s one piece of equipment I’d die for it would be an indoor wood fired oven/smoker…
Bell just gave up a 2 out HR to .180 hitting Recker to tie it in the 13th, 3-3.
Hell of a game. AZ takes the lead in the 14th and Nieuwenhuis just tied it with a HR in the bottom of the 14th.
And yep- AZ goes back ahead again in the 15th…I know I’m talking to myself.
It’s a bummer AZ won, but that was a terrific baseball game. In fact, the Mets/AZ series was a really good series. It’s a series that didn’t mean much to the Mets other than trying to change the culture of losing their team has been going through.
And even though AZ won, Bell and another of their relievers both blew saves, and AZ knows they have bigtime bullpen issues.
Villalona just drove in 2 with a double for Richmond. I know, I know. Dead red hacker yada yada. Still an interesting guy to watch. 7 RBIs now, in his 4th game at AA.
Trade bait?
Maybe.But you know, for a guy who hadn’t done anything baseball wise for 3 years before the DSL last year, I think he’s put up some pretty fair numbers. Maybe he’s the Dominican Big Sexy…
You never know…will be interesting to watch him to see where he goes…
Salt – I don’t see the Griz getting much in return for Villalona, so why not hold on to him, and hope like hell he blossoms into a serviceable 1B.
Any team trading for lincecum would have to take a hard look at his splits given where he plays. At ATT his numbers even this year aren’t bad at all, but on the road he’s getting lit up–BA against is 100 points higher, along with OB and slugging. His ERA over last two years is still 5.00-ish, and that’s pitching half his games here.
Where could he go and get a better park to pitch in? Even Seattle has moved fences in.
Well, it hasn’t been as hot here as it is where Michael is, but the Sacto valley is on it’s seventh straight day of 105+. That ties an all-time record. Here in the Sierra foothills, it has been 100 or plus in Placerville for quite a few days, too. We are about 10 degrees or so cooler here in Camino.
We’re doing a homemade burger thing and then will go down to Placerville and watch fireworks tonight from a hilltop parking lot across from the county fairgrounds.
Meeting my daughter and her boyfriend tomorrow for the Giant-Bum game. Should be fun. We’ll be in lower box 123…pretty decent seats. My daughter’s boyfriend (currently pitching coach/scouting coordinator for Sacramento State) interviews for the pitching coach position with USF on Monday.
Enjoy the remainder of the 4th Flappers.
Very cool to think that 237 years ago today that a ragged-assed army of American patriots defeated the most powerful army in the world, and that a nation was born.
back from the block party…too much, over the top, even Katie was ready to go. And if I was gonna drive us out of there safely, it was then or never. We can watch the fireworks from the hill at our house. It overlooks most of the south bay–the Great America show, the Shoreline show and usually something in the east bay that we can see. It’s cool and free and safe.
Regarding my post of Timmy getting 4 years/68mil that Lurie guessed at earlier today, I think that’s high in terms of years and money. But Edwin Jackson, who sucks, got 4 years 52 mil last year from the clueless Cubbies. Kyle Lohse got 3 years 33 mil from the Brewers. Those 2 were coming off better single years than Timmy but they had nothing in terms of the “back of baseball your card” credibility that Linceum has. He could EASILY get an E-Jack deal.
But I think he’s going to get 2 years, 34 million from Seattle or someone else (not us) and I could see him taking that in a nano second over a 1-year deal anywhere since the person who knows he isn’t going to rebuild his rep back to what it was more than anyone is Timmy himself. Take the 34 mil, bank that, and by the time the rest of the league catches up to the fact that you aren’t a 15-20 million dollar a year starting pitcher anymore, you’ve already exercised most of your earning power.
If the reliever thing is in his future he’ll dabble in it after the 2 year/34 mil deal expires…..
Well, we’ll see what he gets. It does depend a great deal on how he finishes this year. And of course he’s not going to get back to where he was in his CY years. He is going to have to reinvent himself. If he gets 17 million per in free agency knowing what he’s done last year and this one, I want that GM’s address. I finally have a buyer for those crates of tuna squeezers…
well, look what E-Jack got. And winning 2 Cy Young’s and being 29 does count to 29 other GM’s who didn’t watch his last 50 starts.
Still, 50 starts is now about a 1/4 of his career starts and it’s time to stop looking in the rear view mirror at his career. How many of those 50 starts would any of you pay him what we are paying him now? How many of you would pay him 13-15 mil on a one year deal next year to re-establish his value (and that’s what he would cost on a year deal)?
Every GM in MLB and several thousand couch GMs know what he’s done in 2012 and 2013. Which is why I think he’ll take that one year deal. That’s based on how he’s pitching now. The 13-15 sounds about right to score the same or a litlle more for a multiyear deal after 2014.
If he went 1-year it would probably be a Dan Haren deal. Something like that. 13. But whatever, it could be more or less, I just hope we aren’t the team paying him. I’ll be shocked if he doesn’t get a 2-3 year deal……
You could be right, The Jackson deal, among others, shows that there are some people getting paid to make dumb decisions. Shit, I do that for nothing.
I’m really more interested in discussing this year. I’m not waving the white flag. Earlier today, you were responding to Zumie about this season not being “Torres or Blanco’s* fault. I only read that exchange once but I didn’t read it that way. Most fans are looking at this slide as a two-fold problem:
1) injuries. Voggy, Casilla, Gaudin, Pagan, and now we have Scoots and Crawford playing on one good hand (and one good hip between the two of them). And while Pablo is back I refuse to believe that he’s healthy. Nothing explains this complete metamorphoses into *this guy*. I tried to come up with some examples of *this guy* and I couldn’t. Maybe Rajai Davis during his waning days with us? Don’t laugh, he’s late and swinging at everything and missing by a country mile on pitches the same way that Davis did at the end of his time here. That’s what Pablo looks like right now. Maybe not quite as bad but close.
2) Pence, who doesn’t have an injury excuse like Scoots and Craw, has sucked dick for too long.
3) If there was going to be a *3* (and I hadn’t planned one but the sun’s still up so here goes) it would be the abject and utter failure of the AAA guys who have been brought up. Rosario and Dunning are marginally useful and everyone seems to thing Kick will thrive in the BP (we’ll see) but by and large, the replacements have bumped the WAR numbers WAY up for all the regular guys they’ve been subbing for (if that’s how it worked which it doesn’t but it reads that way)…….
Well, I don’t know what most fans think, what I’ve seen here puts a lot of the blame on Torres and Blanco. More than is justified, IMO. They’re not guys who will carry the team- there are guys who are getting paid to do that who aren’t earning their pay. Torrres and Blanco have been as advertised and if they aren’t going to lead the team to the postseason, they’re not going to keep them from it either. The pen looks to be coming back, Casilla will be a huge help. I’m now on board with another starting pitcher and reliever. If we get that, and the guys being paid to hit do the job, we can win it with Torres and Blanco, IMO. As I saId earlier, it’s not *ideal* that they both play rather than platooning and I’m not against picking up another OFer, but it will not make enough of difference if Panda and Pence in particular don’t hit and the bullpen can’t get it to Romo with a lead.
I’m not a fireworks guy. I might be the only person burned by fireworks gone astray in the ‘Stick parking lot. A hot ember from some parking lot pyrotechnics actually landed on my sneaker and burned through. I had to go the hospital.
I only read this thread thru once, didn’t catch all the nuances of the comments, but I didn’t read where anyone put *a lot of blame* on Torres or Blanco. That’s you just trying to stir something up that’s not there. If you’re talking about the comment I made about them in the main thread, I don’t think anyone, including you, sees either of them as a starting OF at this point–we’re making due with them, but no one is blaming them for the problems that have resulted in where were are today–certainly not blaming them in anything other than a *part of the problem* thing. They are a peripheral part of the overall problem. Still, replacing an OF spot with a *Rios* would solve some major problems in that it would boost the offense daily and allow Torres and Blanco to go back to a platoon role which all of us agree they are suited for………..
Ok,I gotta pack up for the 100 yard hike. I’ll check in with you guys from my phone later tonight.
by the way, great 4th of July story twin, that’s a good one.
I wasn”t stirring anything up, stop that. It’s been a pleasant day of comment, and I’m not happy to have you f*** with me again It’s sounding like you wanted to engage me just to find disagreement to make a BFD of. Both Zumie and Chi have put entirely too much on them. And that’s fine, that’s their opinion just as I have mine. But the comment wasn’t directed at them individually, nor to any particular commenter here. Torres in particular was the subject of calls to DFA him earlier this year. It’s not one frigging thread, it’s been several threads here and elsewhere. Anyway, enjoy the fireworks.
all I did was notice that you were completely off base by suggesting that *a lot of blame* has been attributed by Flappers to Torres and Blanco. You read what you want to read. One post = 10 posts. Or more. And then that false truth fuels your fire. Nothing here is targeting one or 2 individuals. And if you read through ALL the comments, you’d see that.
Not sure how my *under the top* comments tonight contributed to me *attempting to ruin your evening* but if that’s what I did I certainly apologize. I’m out for the night, sun is almost down, whoever you are where ever you are, enjoy the night………..
I was correct. You just took it to mean just today.One of the really silly things you pull is suggesting that I have this “fire” to be fueled. There was no attack or anything at all over the line in anything I said. I stated an opinion that was disagreed with. That’s what people do on blogs. I responded- in a civil manner. No fire, nothing to fuel. As I said, it was a pleasant day of comment, disagreement is part of it sometimes. And absolutely no cause for you to rag on me for ANYTHING.
I understand missing Pagan- the memory of the walk off is vivid still and so is the memory of what he did for most of last year. And the swagger, the salute, they resonate with the fans and his teammates- but it was no exaggeration that he was a 10 million dollar man performing like the 2 million dollar man. His defense and hitting from the lead off spot were not not up to snuff and no spark plug talk can change that. It is the wish that he would start to play like he did in 2012, not the reality. With Torres once again playing the stellar defense that knowledgeable fans expected from him, if you factor in defense, the Pagan that we saw this year is a downgrade from both Torres and Blanco. But again- they *are* better platooning, I’m fine with another outfielder if he’s better than what we got from Pagan this year.
Good night.
I’m skeptical they will be able to get much of an upgrade over Blanco/Torres. Haven’t heard any names mentioned, as in previous years. They got Pence for Nate and Joseph, who would they deal this time? Crick is about the only top 100. They just don’t have much depth except in A ball. Failure of guys like Hector Kieschnick Brown Hembree Heston Kickham hurts them as either replacements or trade chips.
Maybe another Cody Ross will fall into their lap.