Swept By The Cubs, Grasping for Answers as a Giants Fan
How long ago does this feel to you?
Today, the Giants have more wins than exactly 5 other lowly, out of it teams. Also, happening today, they’re going here:
So it is a very surreal, incongruent time for YOUR San Francisco Giants these days….
Things have gotten so bad that there is actual documented calls, from both fans and the media, for BRETT FREAKING PILL to be called up for extended play at first base. Hey, Belt has been horrible lately and has not brought the offensive numbers that you need from a first baseman in 2013 but let me be one Giants fan who will raise his hand with a resounding *Nay* on Brett Pill taking over first base to *see what he can do*. I’ll save you the pending wonderment: he will do nothing.
As the trade deadline approaches, there are rumors that Sabean wants to trade Javier Lopez for a *MLB ready starting pitcher*. If that’s true, then Brian Sabean truly has a no feel for what his player currency is worth. And it will probably be the reason Lincecum doesn’t get traded–although he should be traded. He’s got 10+ strikeouts in 3 of his last 4 starts and the one start he failed to strike out 10 was the start post-no hitter and I think everyone forgives him for that one. Anyone, whether you are a scout or a fan, can see how well Timmy is throwing the ball right now. And it sucks because Sabean is going to sit on his hands and do nothing at the trade deadline, holding on to Lincecum for no reason other than he can’t overcome his own stubbornness. #FreeTimLincecum
A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball 
Where is the RESET button? How about an EASY button?
Is this the low? I have been an every day fan for 34 years since 1979. Every day checking in and listening to KNBR for the first 11 years through college and then back as an every day listener when I got back home from grad school.
Even in years since and after moving to DC, every day during baseball season revolved at some point on finding out what the Giants were doing and following the trials and tribulations on a daily basis, every loss stinging and every win full of hope the Giants were going to make it theirt year…years oif heartbreak!
Then they go and win two World Series and now complacency has set it in with me and this is the first year, I hate to admit this, I am not really keeping up the team on a daily basis. Hell, I am hardly watching their games while even paying for the MLB package.
So watching how they played this weekend was maddening. I cannot remember 3 losses in a row by a run each especially against a weak team such as the Cubs and especially by watching how they blew the first two.
The torture has begun again and the struggle is reminding me of all the many dark years we had as fans, especially my first 8 years following our team…so now I will probably begin the daily grind of tearing my hair out and screaming at the team and following back in the love with the Giants all over again!
Good to see you here again.
Maybe Barack will give them a ‘kick in the ass’ speech today…
From what I understand, Colon would appeal and nothing would happen until after the season.
I think Javy Lopez is going to be moved, but I agree I am not sure what he brings back. What we all see is a farm system that does not have many or any major league ready players.
The Dodgers landing that Cuban SS is the type of move I think they should be doing. It is a sad day to see the Dodgers putting everything together.
But Lincecum is the one guy teams may be willing to cough up some talent for and I personally don’t see the Giants signing Timmy to anything beyond a couple of years. Affeldt is another that I think will draw interest.
If they are not going to offer Pence a deal now, they should be dangling him as well…
I do not see Affeldt getting any action. With his contract (this year, and two more at 6 mil per) I just don’t see teams willing to take that on for what they potentially get in return (he has not had a great year).
If you did trade Lincecum, what type of player(s) would you be looking to get back?
I don’t think anyone is trading anything like young mlb ready SPs for a Javier lopez type loogy.
I’d wait to see how well Tim pitches on the road before deciding, but if he is halfway *back* I would think he’d be worth at least the $14 mil qualifying type offer talked about. And I bet he’d take it/work out similar deal. Giants are still gonna need 1-2 SPs anyway, even if he stays, aren’t they?
UFO’s Rock Bottom new walk up music!
I’ve been calling for trading Tim now for about 10 days or so, maybe more. After the No No. He is pitching well. He’s got something going again. And, he’s GONE next season, most likely. Why would you not trade him to a team in contention? So, you can get a compensatory pick for an unknown kid that MIGHT help you in 4-5 years? That’s crazy. So, that’s what the Giants will do…
I don’t think Tim is interested in going to a warm weather east or central team, where he would be in much more hitter friendly yards and pitching in hotter and more humid climes. Other than seattle or Anaheim, I don’t think he has options he would enjoy. And the M’s moved the fences in this year, and HRs have flourished. Just imo.
And again, I wonder what he would bring–a Mark Trumbo type or younger *prospect*?
If SF has good enough pitching, they can win their share of torture games with Pagan and one more stick…if pitching sucks then that becomes way more difficult to compete.
It would be unusual, but they can trade Timmeh now, and there’s nothing stopping him from coming back here as a FA. You can have all the secret handshakes you want about re-signing a rental player, but we know how Beltran turned out…
A majority of players, once traded, do not return to the team from which they were traded. If Tim gets traded…I think it a fat chance he would come back here as a FA.
Agreed Chi. But, my calculus says he’s not coming back. You ride out this lost season with him just for a big sendoff his last home game? And, then a compensatory pick to get — somebody — with, if all goes swimmingly an arrival time at ATT for maybe 2018? I say get near term prospects now…
I agree with you, snarkk re: getting more value from a trade as opposed to a compensatory pick. Although, if the Giants keep sucking ass, the pick could be a pretty decent one. But agree…a trade “should” bring more of a return.
Btw, Flav I agree wholeheartedly about your comment last night about sac flies; the ground ball outs in that situation are maddening. Esp with sacks loaded, the pitcher is the one in trouble—at some point in the AB he has to throw you a strike (and you get 3 of them) and all you have to do is get the ball in the air a decent enough distance. Just not smart baseball from too impatient hitters that get taken advantage of. Interesting too that Sandoval was patient enough to get 2 more walks yesterday.
the cubs 8-9 hitters yesterday each hit one in the air far enough to leave the yard.
The Biogenesis decisions are due this week, in time to let the 50-game suspensions occur this season and, perhaps, in time to trigger some last minute dealing before the non-waiver trade deadline. The A’s may be looking for a pitcher, for example; the Rangers, an OF; the Tigers, a SS; etc.
I’ve seen no hints that any Giant is on the BioG list, although such a circumstance might go part way toward explaining the utter lack of spirit in the dugout lately. . . .
It seems like whenever the Giants load the bases, the next guy up swings at the first pitch and pops/ grounds out into a force play, or some lame ass shit like that. No patience, no working the count, just flail at the first pitch you see like an over active high schooler.
“Aggressive” at the plate has been the watch word for years with the Giants. Bochy publicly talks this up all the time as his preference, so it’s no longer an issue to me as to why they are this way. Krueger called it “brain dead” ABs, and got crucified for it because he tied it to Latin players, which was wrong — only in that he tied it to one group. Virtually all the Giants do this. Who are the patient hitters? Posey. Belt used to be and had the OBP to prove it, until they F’d him up so much now he doesn’t know what to swing at. Scutaro. That’s about it. Leadoff guys being patient? Ha. Everybody else swings as if the next pitch will be the last they’ll see, seemingly almost with intentional disregard of the situation…
Bartolo Colon must be shitting bricks right about now.
Bartolo is the one guy who isn’t shitting bricks. He’s old he doesn’t give a shit about tomorrow he’s living for today. He’ll appeal, finish off his final season and then ride off into the sunset.
Funny thing is, if only Bartolo “appeals,” the final decision could occur quickly. And nobody wants to see a BioG malefactor pitching in the post season.
You’re right.
Although a malefactor who has served his time would be another thing, in the PS.
I was agreeing with flavor. Appeal will delay it until after the season IMO.
Section 8 of the Joint Drug Agreement establishes the time line for appeals to an arbitration panel. There’s a lot of language about doing things as soon as practicable and expeditiously, etc. The panel is supposed to convene a hearing within 20 days of the trigger date (which is three biz days after the punishment is issued), and the panel is supposed to issue its “award” within 25 days of the hearing. (The panel gets a month to prepare a written opinion.) So even if the panel drags things out, that puts its award smack into the middle of the PS. And I don’t think anybody’s going to drag out these hearings. The panel can move quickly if it wants to.
Colon could be using some sort of HGH something or other, or wink wink, he’s totally legit at the age of 40+. At this point, like every other player, we don’t know, and most fast don’t care, until / if he gets busted again. I don’t see the point in suspending him again for some kind of paperwork association with this Biogenesis joint, unless it is well beyond the time he got busted last season…
If the paperwork proves years of purchasing (and use) before last season, or purchasing and use after his test last year, or purchasing and use of PEDs other than the testosterone he positively tested for last season, why not pop him again?
Well, if paperwork evidence is enough under the CBA drug rules, who am I to argue? But, I guess I have a problem with getting “convicted” because of paperwork of an alleged drug dealer. At least with getting busted for failing a drug test, there is direct evidence of illicit “use” under the rules. Because someone mailed a prescription for Cialis to me doesn’t necessarily mean I’ve actually used the stuff, or that I even actually ordered it unless there is documentary or testimonial evidence of the order…
Well, he’s having the season of his life right now. He gets booted, and thus ruins the A’s shot. and the chance at another one-year, $14 mill deal, he wouldn’t be exactly dancing in the streets.
What? business records showing a pattern of purchase and the business owner/dealer himself testifying to their authenticity and accuracy? Cancelled checks or other receipts? Order forms, emails, etc.? That evidence is better than one positive test. And under the Joint Drug Agreement it’s devastating.
btw, we now have a very dramatic demonstration of just how important Greg Anderson’s testimony would’ve been in the Bonds trial. If he’d taken the stand and authenticated his own records, etc., and described what he did for Bonds, Bonds would be facing a whole lot more than a somewhat shaky conviction for giving a rambling answer to a bad question before the GJ.
I think mlb has been negotiating with his reps for quite a while. If the evidence proves purchases over the long term for Bartolo, or purchases after his test last season, his 50 game suspension last year may not suffice to get him off the hook now. On the other hand, maybe the evidence will support a time-served decision. Either way, I’ll be he knows where he stands.
So, why is MLB just now getting around to the suspension drama coming to a head, less than 48 hours before the trade deadline? Could they plan this any worse for teams in contention that might be affected? Or, was this what they intended all along, for some reason?…
Related to what Xoot said at 9:13am – The Rangers are looking because there is a better than even chance that they will lose Cruz due to PEDs. They, along with quite a few teams are looking at Pence, whom I think we should sign ASAP because of the paucity of free agent outfielders next season. In short, we need to lock up 2/3 of our outfield for next season or we are in big trouble.
Kruk on KNBR said this morning that he thought the overriding reason the Giants suck is that they are “out of gas”. Brilliant. I can understand why the starters might have had that excuse at the beginning of the season after a long postseason run, followed by ST, but now the starters seem to have it getting together, pretty much, except Zito, and he’s always out of gas anyway. But, position players? Why would they be out of gas since mid friggin’ May? At least physically. Blanco I would agree with, he showed symptoms last year of being tired by mid-season, and I said so then — he’s never been a FT player. But, the others? I don’t buy it, at least physically out of gas. Mentally, that’s another story. IMO they mentally checked out a while ago, and the coaching staff has shown signs of that, too. Kruk didn’t get into details of whether he was saying physically or mentally out of gas — he would never accuse the team of not wanting it, at least directly. But, he’s dancing around that without saying it…
I’m not buying that, either. I heard Heyman say the same thing about the Giants on an NYC station earlier today, that the Giants are “tired.” If that’s so, then how come the Tigers, who played only three fewer playoff games than the Giants, aren’t equally spent instead of cruising along at 59-45 with pretty much the same team?
Right. The kind of tiredness we seem to be displaying is post-Series-Huffian-party-on fatigue. We miss Angel Pagan, too. Mac, you still going to games in Philly? No ballet? (They’re on vac.) Hope to see you in Cuse next weekend.
Detriot is who we should deal with.
Timmeh, Lopez,Pill,and some mid level prospect for LF Nick Castellanos.and Rick Porcello.
Tigers just closed a deal with Astros for Houston’s closer…
I know there’s about 60 some odd games to go, but seriously. I don’t want my team to go down as one of the worst falls from grace in modern sports history. That is sobering. Surely, yes, there are plenty of examples of a championship team falling down the next year. But, to this level of ineptitude? If it continues through the season, it will be downright embarrassing, and unfortunately worthy of historical comparison. I don’t want that. They need to gather themselves, and start thinking about playing for pride. Like JT Snow said about two weeks ago, they need to “play baseball”. So, Bochy needs to whip some ass and change this clubhouse atmosphere. The pitching seems to be pretty much coming around, the rest of the team has to stiffen. This past Cubs series was shameful baseball, IMO. Keystone Kops territory…
well they can start by stopping and ending this ridiculous “Frenchie attempt at re-birth”. Peguero would almost certainly play as hard as he could and for as much pride as he could muster–young guy trying to make a name for himself would at least be easier to watch than an outfielder who clearly isn’t a legit major leaguer anymore.
Agreed. This is the type of thing that frosts me about Sabean. 40,000 butts at every game (well, paid tickets, at least), and you bring in a guy like Francouer to START? Off the scrappiest scrap heap — the ROYALs said he was done? To me, that’s an insult to the fan base. I’m serious. Even a casual fan knows this guy is cannon fodder. It’s ridiculous. There’s no good reason for it. It’s a nowhere move….
Frenchie goes down as one of the most moronic acquisitions in SFG history. Someone — maybe even Schulman — was originally touting it as a Pat Burrell-type pickup. #delusional #psychotic #koolaid
“Pee Wee Herman” says the Giants are ready to listen to trade offers . . . http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/san-francisco-giants-trade-deadline-hunter-pence-tim-lincecum-javier-lopez-072813
If they don’t at least trade Lopez for a prospect of some sort, Sabes can be accused of sleepwalking through the deadline. What good, to a team playing out the string, is a guy who throws to one hitter, maybe every other game?…
For the month of July split, here’s some interesting stats, IMO. From mlb.com.
The Giants staff is 14 out of 15 in team ERA, at 4.43. Only the Pads are worse.
But, for the month SF is 10th in WHIP. So, what’s the big deal moving up 4 notches in that category? Well, around the 10th spot, the Cards and Braves are barely better than the Giants in WHIP for July. Essentially the same. And, those are top divisional teams. One thing that tells me is that the Giants bad ERA is hiding even worse defense than the SF defensive stats show, and those are bad anyway. Second, the punchless scoring becomes even more obvious. In July, the Giants, surprise, are dead last in the NL in team OPS, runs scored, HRs, and .Slg. They’ve cleaned up dead last in all hitting categories. Inexplicably, they’re actually 5th best in taking walks for July. Who’s 1st and 2nd in July ERA and WHIP in the NL? Doghairs by a lot, then the Reds. Same order for top two in team OPS. No wonder LA has been on a month long winning streak. I say watch out for the Reds, IF they can get in to the PS…
It’s pathetic that I feel upbeat today merely because we can’t LOSE! Leonard Cohen: “And wasn’t it a long way down…” (I’ve posted that before. It’s the sad refrain from the chorus of “Hopes Dashed Like Broken Crystal Dropped From the Upper Deck.” Or, to quote Leonard Cohen again: “Let’s sing another song, boys. This one has grown old and bitter.”)
Kershaw. He pitched 39 frames in the month, the most of any starter in the NL. Wainwright was second at 36 innings. For July, Kershaw’s ERA was 1.62. WHIP? A ridiculous 0.59. Both stats the best of any NL starter with over 30 innings pitched for the month. That is insane. How he lost one game is beyond me. Is he the new Koufax? Too soon to tell, but boy, is he going to make a lot of dough…
I’m not really upbeat. This is a bad dream that continues even after you wake up, have tea or coffee, go to work, have more tea or coffee, and have lunch, then dinner. And yet the bad dream continues. When does the nightmare end??
Well when Sabean decided to bring back Andres Blorres who was done after the 2011 season,just because he’s loyal to the core with ex has beens.Good chance the OF was gonna be shitty with no power at all,except for the Reverend.
Kat, along with others, I think losing Pagan was really a huge blow. It can’t be exaggerated how much energy and intangibles he brought. This Blanco/Torres tandem just doesn’t cut it. Essentially, the Giants have been playing with one MLB quality OFer since Pagan went down. You can’t consistently win games that way. Sabes admitted on KNBR last Thursday that he was concerned about the thin OF in the offseason, should there be a significant injury out there. But, he did squat about it. He didn’t say why he was worried, yet did virtually nothing about it. A huge admission of bad GMing, IMO…
This is a team wide collapse. Pagan would be left standing on 3rd while Posey Pablo and Pence flail away. And then Cain Zito Tim give up 4 runs the next inning aided by 2 errors in the field.
No dispute it’s been team wide. I just think the loss of Pagan was a big precipitator of it. I wouldn’t be surprised if we hear, as usual in the offseason, that there was some kind of serious clubhouse funkiness going on this season, for whatever reason(s) yet to be revealed. That would be a reasonable explanation for the mentally lackluster play…
Wait a second, didn’t you guys see yesterdays game? We had the bases loaded with nobody out and we scored (well, after getting two outs). That changes everything, they are going to turn this around and start scoring in bunches. We are going to be scoring so much that MLB will have to borrow the blood mobile to do all the PED testing.
Edd, if your out there, don’t let these guys get your dauber down. We are going to make a run for it.
Ed’s not here today . . . As your Flap Team co-co-manager, he is overseeing your Clown team’s remedial hitting and pitching drills this afternoon. 🙂
Brewers Owner announced Monday that each fan who shows up with a ticket to any of the team’s 12 home games in August will receive a $10 voucher that will be good for food, beverages, tickets or merchandise. Excellent gesture on his part, but I would have also liked to have seen the owner offer a shirt/jersey exchange like the Patriots did. Sure, he didn’t murder anyone, but he still mislead people, most notably the Brewers fans who spend money on his merchandise. That piece of shit Braun should match (or go beyond) what the owner is doing. Instead, that punk gets a vacation.
Let’s get Baer to offer everyone two free beers or two well drinks for free, on the Giants, for Flapalooza night. Chances of that? Hopefully, they won’t be 20 games below .500 by then. And, Surkamp won’t be the starter…
That means Pawlie has to show up. He’s the only one with Baer’s business card and/or knows the secret handshake to get past Giants security where Baer’s luxury suite is.
Well regarding the Braun fiasco…look at if from the poor fans’ point of view, and the GM’s (or whoever inked his last deal). They’re saddled with that dickwad through 2020. Yep…you saw it correctly 20 fucking 20 (oh, and a mutual option year in 2021).
I think Francouer was worth a shot..a no cost look. Agree its time to cut bait but Peguero et al are hitting 100 pts less than Babe Pill for gawd sakes. It’s all too depressing.
Again, the problem goes well beyond LF.
Just heard the White House visit on Knbr– if you’re a ball player, no matter your stature, and the president references you by name, man that’s got to be one of the coolest moments of your life.
And guys like Abreu, Gaudin and Tanaka must be shooting each other sly grins feeling like wedding crashers
They should have had Abreu taking dives for grounders on the South Lawn during the ceremony…
So, nice pic topping today’s thread, BF. Comparing the two rings. I like the first one, by far. The Orange and Black motif is just right. With the iconic bridge design. And, the roundish = baseball shape of the interior “World Champions” encircling the SF logo. The other one is nice, but looks too bulky for some reason. And, no Orange, though the pic of that ring on the side looks like maybe there’s an orangish hue to the SF logo diamonds. I don’t like mention of the “DET” team on the side. This ring should not be about the team you beat, it’s that YOUR team won. If anyone knows if there is any significance to the number of diamonds on each edge, I’d be happy to know. Also, does the first ring have the player’s name enscribed somewhere that we can’t see?…
Oh and Moscoso was probably sitting there thinking he was in someone else’s dream lol
Same deal with Frenchy.
One of the best guys just asked Sabean if he had any trade announcements and he responded “I’m announcing a nap in 20 minutes.”
Hilarious. Nice to see that “time is of the essence” to him right now
Beat not best
Appropos of his phone-readiness talked about a coupla years back, I wonder if Sabes & Co. have their cell phones at the ready for the offers pouring in. Reminds me of his Thursday talk on KNBR about his not liking this time of the season at all, i.e., deadline dealing. If you’re a GM, isn’t this time of year what you get paid the big bucks for? I didn’t understand that comment. Made no sense to me. If I were a GM, I’d be stoked about this time of year, maybe a bit less than normal if my team sucked. But, I’d still be into working hard to soak buyers as much as possible to re-stock my sorry ass team. Quite often, Sabes says shit, when he actually says something, that just has me scratching my head about what this dude is really about…
To answer the question, it does not seem that long ago. first two WS rings ever?? They will never be forgotten. As far as the current team goes. welll…they suck. lets be frank here. For whatever reason they are playing awful baseball. Last NL team to win back to back WS 75-76 Reds so it is not easy!! What is hard to swallow is the fact they are not even playing competitively. If I was Mr. Bochy. Give Buster true days off. Play Belt at first everyday. Belt laid a big Egg yesterday, but he is not the reason for the season. with all that said, they will always be my Giants. Good, bad, ugly. Who cares it is Giants baseball.
7 diamonds/side, 7 championships for the SF/NY GIants. Player name is on the other side.
Thanks. Do the 9 little diamonds on the sides of the first ring mean anything?…
“Do the 9 little diamonds on the sides of the first ring mean anything?…”
There is a message hidden inside the 7th diamond and it will lead you to the second keystone of the Rosslyn Chapel, whose docent turns out to be Sabean’s long-lost brother, whom Sabean had been told died as a child in the car accident that killed his parents. The guardian of Rosslyn Chapel, Marie Chauvel Saint Clair, is Sabean’s long-lost grandmother, and the widow of Jacques Saunière. It is revealed that Sabean is a descendant of Jesus Christ and Mary Magdalene. The Priory of Sion hid his identity to protect him from possible threats to his life.
The real meaning of the last message is that the Grail is buried beneath the small pyramid directly below the inverted glass pyramid of the Louvre. It also lies beneath the “Rose Line,” an allusion to “Roslyn.” Sabes figures out this final piece to the puzzle, but he does not appear inclined to tell anyone about this. 🙂
If he’s got those bloodlines, howinhell did he trade for Ryan Garko?…
I wish Flavor would take a nap too. Sabean knows not to trade from weakness.
It’s from a strength you dope. There is a dearth of quality OF and Starting pitchers. Pence and Timmy are part of the “supply” and with the 2 extra WC spots the demand is great.
I think Nip is onto something. We are the worst offensive team in the NL, Sabes goes for pitching. Sabes has everything backwards…
Frenchy is are new Ryan Garko and once Sabes wakes up just in time to trade our only productive outfielder in Pence for more scrubs we will end up the year with Frenchy Torres and Blanco.That will be exciting to watch..NOT!!!!
On mlb.com, not ONE mention anywhere of the Giants being at the WHouse. Not one photo, blurb, link, anywhere that I can see. If the Yanks or RSox were at the WHouse today, there’d be 4 stories on it…
Well you know, all those festivities in inducting those dead guys into the HOF can really mess up your schedule.
New post on my blog . . . http://aroundtheworldwithblade.wordpress.com/2013/07/29/bozeman-montana-fireworks-display-july-4th-2013/
Hey, at least Frenchy actually got a hit with the bases loaded over the weekend. (Friday’s game).
Mac, was that the one over the pitcher’s head (in the infield)?
It was a bloop to right, drove in 2, but it was the play that Belt got caught between third and home for the second out.
Why isn’t Brandon Moss making $254 million dollars? Pujols 17 HR, Moss 17 HR, Pujols 49 runs, Moss 44 runs, Pujols, 64 RBI, Moss 49 RBI. Oh, almost forgot – Pujols had almost 100 more at bats than Moss.
because he’s hitting .234 and that’s as a platoon player…
Umm . . . You did know I was kidding, right? 😉
your comment was out of context, I didn’t see if you were responding to someone else. So, I took it as a serious post
And, the Puj is on the DL as of yesterday for plantar fasciitis, might be out for the year. He’s making Rohand’s deal look brilliant…
The Comcast coverage of the Giants visit to the White House was good, except…..they had Ratto as one of the commentators. Bad choice. He didn’t even know who the Giants play next. At the end of the ceremony, Ratto said: “And now the Giants will get ready to play the Nationals.”
Ratto’s schtick is to skewer everything, as cloyingly clever, in his mind, as possible. He’s got so much snark, I sing “Over the Rainbow” in comparison. Hard to besmirch a celebration of winning it all, so agreed, kinda crazy having him cover it …
Wow…amazing how from last year and being fresh WS winners, Sabes goes from being a baseball god, to this week he is a total fuckwad who doesn’t know what he is doing.
Believe me, there have been many times I have been critical of Sabean, but I don’t even think he is the crux of the problem here. “The moves” are all hypothetical at this point.
This fucking tailspin (extended, at that) is predominantly on the players. This is basically the team that won it all last year. They can, and should be playing much better ball than what you would expect from the Keystone Kops.
Now if Sabeas does trade Pence, then I will certainly have some words (unless he scores multiple TOP prospects). I mean really, the team already needs a LFer for next year. Going into 2014 needing a LFer AND a RFer would just be awful.
Totally down with what you said Chi. Sabes is not the issue here. Let him do his job. We know zero about what is going on behind the scenes.
Of course Sabes is part of the issue, Blade. The team is in free fall. It’s his job to do something to have prevented that, and to fix it now. He’s in charge of putting the players on the roster. There has to be some accountability for him somewhere. If not, then he also gets no credit for the two titles…
Well, we’ll just have to respectfully agree to disagree. I am totally down with Sabes being God like for his entire time in San Francisco. In my opinion, no SF GM comes close . . . The 2 WS trophies confirm this (sheesh, one in my life time makes him a Saint).
Besides, as I said to Chi a few minutes ago, we have no idea how this plays out. Believe me, Sabes has a plan and talking to Schulman, us, or other media isn’t his MO. Also, it may not “play out” until after the season, e.g., extensions, trades, free agent signings, minor league promotions, etc.
snarkk – he may own a piece of the free-fall…but 99% of it is on the players. He built this roster, and THE PLAYERS have NOT performed. The trade window has not closed. As Steve says, we don’t know what is going on behind the scenes. It very well may play out that there are NO deals worth doing. Regardless…the players own most of the clusterfuck the team is experiencing now…not Sabean.
I would put more of it on the coaching staff than Sabes, Evans, and Tidrow, etc.
“Going into 2014 needing a LFer AND a RFer would just be awful.”
Again, spot on. Who does he get? Juan fucking Pierre? HAHAHAHAHA . . . There is no one else next year. You said, “predominantly” the players are responsible . . . I will go one step further – This is ALL on the players. Every Flapper was down with this team at the end of Spring Training. Moreover, I don’t think anyone thought this team would realistically win the WS again. That’s pretty tough to do under the best of circumstances. Conversely, no one expected them to suck the baloney poney either. Regardless, the players are totally responsible for this epic failure.
I was down with most of it, not Torres, who I thought was old news, and turned out to be. But, he’s far from the point. Sabes is paid $2 million / year to be ready and plan for problems, we’re just bullshitting here. He said the other day he thought over winter they were thin in the OF, if somebody got really hurt. So, Pagan gets really hurt, and bingo, the OF is a disaster. He admitted he foresaw problems, but did not cover it. That’s his job, not ours…
I am sure Sabean explored options outside of the ones tried to date (Blanco/Torres platoon, Tanaka, Frenchy, etc.), but my guess is there was no one available that fit the cost parameters (money or prospects). You just can’t pull a bad-ass OFer outta thin air. OFers are a very limited commodity right now.
“Suck the baloney poney” that is fucking priceless…sitting here at work LOL. People are probably now going “WTF” is going on over there?!
I agree Steve on the agree to disagree part. The quandry of our team lies mainly with the players. They need to fucking man up and play some clean inspired baseball for the remaining 56 games.
My friend Mike (Demp28) tells me that Kieschnick and Pill have been promoted.
I have seen nothing official. As Mike says…I can smell a DFA for Torres coming…
http://blog.sfgate.com/giants/2013/07/29/sf-giants-to-promote-kieschnick-pill/
h
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2013/07/29/world-series-champion-san-francisco-giants-visit-white-house
In the for-what-it’s-worth column . . .
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/giants-may-deal-pence-lincecum-205028579–mlb.html
Or . . .
The San Francisco Giants are willing to trade right fielder Hunter Pence, right-handed starter Tim Lincecum and reliever Javier Lopez, but the asking price for Pence and Lincecum is steep, according to CBS Sports.
All three players are pending free agents at the end of the year.
The Giants plan to make one-year qualifying offers to Pence and Lincecum at the end of the season, which is expected to be in the $14 million range. If the players do not accept the offers and go other teams, the Giants would receive draft picks as compensation.
Pence is expected to be in high demand since the free agent market will be thin on outfielders. The Texas Rangers and Pittsburgh Pirates are believed to be among the teams most interested in Pence. The Kansas City Royals could also be in the mix.
Lincecum may be harder to deal because of this $21 million salary. He is very popular with the team and fan base despite struggling for a second straight season.
____________________________
Nothing earthshaking here, but I didn’t see anything about Pill and Kieshcnick
I posted the link above (from the Chron)…complements of Hank….
BTW< the fans would be furious if TImmy got traded, but that didn't stop Sabes before (see Matt Williams trade, Will Clark trade) . . .
I don’t understand why the fans would be upset about this. Maybe the chicks and the fair weather fans but if Sabean can get 2 top prospects (even one top of the top see: Profar) why wouldn’t we want him to pull the trigger on that? So that Timmy can stick around for another couple of months pitching and losing? Giants might have to eat some of the rest of this year’s salary too but if it got them 2 good/great prospects I’d do that in a nano-second…..
I am Abso-Fucking-Lutely on board with that…fuck the chicks (pun intended…well, if they’re hot), and the fair-weather fuckwads…
this is from a couple of days ago (top 100 prospects in all of baseball):
“Crick is the only Top 100 player in the Giants’ Minor League system. Brown also made the list in Spring Training — coming in at No. 100 — but has since fallen from the rankings.
The Giants are one of four clubs with just one Top 100 player. The Braves are the only organization with zero. By comparison, National League West foes San Diego, Arizona and Los Angeles have four Top 100 players, and Colorado has three.”
here are the top 100:
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2013/
Would any of you take Oscar Taveras for Timmy? Fucking HELL YES. Now, maybe Timmy wouldn’t net the #2 prospect even if we paid the remainder of his salary.
My point is, there are guys in the top 10-20 (and I’m talking offense) that could fix our 2014 massive position player problem…..
This site is awesome . . . I book marked it – thanks!
This site always confuses me. It shows 2013 stats, but the rankings aren’t updated, are they? Zach Wheeler’s listed at the number 8 prospect slot and he has been pitching for the Mets for a month and a half.
the Brewers finally did something right:
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/milwaukee-brewers-effectively-returning-rest-ryan-braun-2013-181202291.html
Yeah, I mentioned this earlier today Flav.
Tanaka to Fresno, Abreu to DL, kieshnick and Pill back up
If you’re Tanaka, do you just head back to Japan? I’m serious. Dude made a great catch, got a few hits, realized his dream of playing for SF and today he was at the White House. Can you really go back to Fresno now with the drive and enthusiasm needed to get called back up?
What do they do when Braun comes back next year? Mea Culpa night?
.
Fair weather fans or no, Timmy’s seen as the face of the franchise. Regardless of his tailspin. I’m ain’t saying it won’t happen, and I hope it does, mainly because i don’t see him sticking around after this year anyway, but there are a lot of fans who want him to stay.
“BTW< the fans would be furious if TImmy got traded, but that didn't stop Sabes before (see Matt Williams trade, Will Clark trade) . . ."
Bob Quinn traded Will Clark, no?
Actually, no, he didn’t.
I’m a total fan of Tim (duh), but on board absolutely for trading him and getting solid prospects, outfielders preferably. We can sign FA pitchers, the pickens are slim for OFers this offseason. Relatedly, as for Pence, not so much unless the haul in return is big. Trade him, and next season WTF do you do for OFers if you don’t sign him again? You’ll need to go get four of ‘em, or three and hope one of the guys you got in return for Pence is ready — unless Brown or Kieschnick surprise. AND, you hope Pagan recovers well. Otherwise, there’s NOBODY in the OF…
And No way is someone giving the G’s a top 20 or top 50 prospect for erratic Timmy.
You think Will Clark was traded by the Giants to Texas, WTF do you know? Now kindly shut the fuck up and go back to wherever u go after I ban your stupid ass every 6 months or so……
Brett Pill, again. Yay. Maybe they’re trading Belt. For his sake, I hope so…
In the pre-season, Belt was on very few, if ANY top 20 list of MLB 1st baseman. Frankly, on many teams, he would be a back up. In my mind, Belt is who he is – serviceable as a starter, but very little potential to improve in the future.
Krukow was on KNBR this am saying his problem is that he is holding the bat too tightly. Seriously. And he went on and on about it.
Belt is just a guy, there are lot of them out there. Fans like him because he’s got a cool name and he’s a good guy and he tore up the minor leagues, but there’s not a lot there. If anything, he’s regressing…….
Sorry BF. I was typing my crap on Belt while you posted. At least we heard Kruk say the same thing. And, I think he’s FOS, BTW…
Blade, I admit Belt looks like warmed over hash the last 6 weeks. But, he’s far from the only one, and he’s a young player. I hope they trade his ass, and then he turns into the good offensive player I think he can be. This organization has F’d him up from the get go. Early today on the radio Krukow actually said he thought Belt had potential to be a good player, but strangely said he thought he gripped the bat too tightly? Really? So many Giants coaches and advisors have told Belt what to change, it’s no surprise to me he’s just totally gripping. Now, they bring Pill up for the umpteenth time to take some of Belt’s playing time. A change of scenery will do Belt good…
Belt is still pretty young. There’s time to fix his shit. He has a little in common with Matt Williams and the yoyoing he went through before he took off. But, I think he’s fucked here. Trade him and see him progress. Again, though, who replaces him? Pill? If the backups were worth a fuck, they’d be in already.
Exactly, Chuck. Trade Belt, and who plays first? Posey? Panda? I hope they trade him so he can flourish with the fuckin’ Angels or somebody, and then yeah, I won’t deny it, I can say I was right. Seriously. Bochy has no clue how to deal with this kid, and it shows from day one. Grab a Beer!…
Well, Pill could play first base. He wouldn’t play it well but it would at least prove to everyone that he sucks.
Send Belt down to AAA and let him re-group. Or trade him, I don’t care. But he’s not worth shit right now so I’d rather see him go down to Fresno…….
Agree with Flav. It’s not like you’re replacing Willie Mac. These guys are a dime a dozen, e.g., LaRoche, Hart, Reynolds,Teixeira, Berkman, Helton, Moss, etc. Do any of these guys excite you? Of course not. As Flav said, they are “just guys.”
OK, Blade. Trade Belt for a bag of balls. Who is your first baseman?…
What a fucking joke that Ortiz didn’t at least get fined. He should be fined and suspended for that pathetic, out of control bat/phone bullshit. Pedroia kept himself out of harms way, barely, but that was all on him. Ortiz could have easily killed him had his violent bat swing, inches from his head, hit him in the right spot. You DO NOT send a message like this to kids who play baseball. Hell, any kid.
Ortiz was out of control and reckless and it was all caught on tape and shown to the world. “Hey, when your hero gets upset, this is how he vents.No consequences.”
Fuck that, he should have been fined $50,000 and suspended at least a day on principle alone……..
Instead, everyone is playing up the fact that he went 4 for 4 (or something like that) the next day. For the dopers, we give a lifetime ban (ARod possibly), but for violence, we put the dude on a pedestal and say he is “competitive.”
I gotta say, he kicked the shit out of that phone. But you know, when he backed down to Pedoria, MLB felt that was punishment enough.
As far as my eye ball goes, the A’s have about 131 people at their game tonight. Fucking pathetic fan base
Wolff has been shitting on those fans for about 12 years. Eventually it catches up. They tried to dismantle the team last year, but it keeps on ticking.
If Colon gets popped and appeals to arbitration, they’ll let him pitch. He might just make it into the LDS, if things go slowly. I would love to see a PS game at the E Coli with 10,000 people in the stands. Wolff/Fisher would have their sorry asses kicked out of the owners’ group asap.
Kruk never mentioned that bat gripped tightly thing about Rowand. Just about what a good soldier he was.
Kruk is FOS on anything to do with Belt. And, Kuiper is worse…
I watched a heck of a lot of the broadcasts during the “Rowand era,” and I don’t remember a single instance when Krukow or Kuiper said anything negative about Rowand. He was The Gamer, and that was that.
He was making about $11.5 million more per season than Belt. End of story. He could have been creating a mound of sawdust every day in the understadium cage with those 500 swings Kruk exulted about, but not word one about a “tight grip”…
Well, that’s the problem. Pence never gets called out, but Belt does routinely. Panda, pretty much the same thing. They are all sucking yet they pick and choose who to rail on. Which seems to fall under the company line directive.
Rowand escaped fury from K/K but that doesn’t mean’t they both didn’t deserve it–for different reasons, but they both deserve it…….
The A’s pitcher, Griffin, is no-hitting the blue jays. I went to Griffin’s first mlb game, vs. the Giants last summer. Buster hit a two-run blast into the LF stands in the first inning. I think I’d rather remember that moment than watch this A’s game tonight.
I’d be down with the Giants trading Timmy as long as it’s not for the 2013 equivalent of Pat Zachry, Steve Henderson, Doug Flynn and Dan Norman.
I like the Tom Terrific reference, MacDawg.
I’m probably in the minority here, but I don’t give a rat’s ass if the A’s move to San Jose. In fact, I think it would be GOOD for Giants fans. It would inject some competition and motivation into Giants ownership to stop taking this fanbase for granted. As in putting a Blanco/Torres/Peguero/Tanaka/Pill/Perez/Kieschnik/Francouer/bullshitWhoever product in the OF that is ridiculous on its face, in front of a season-long sold out stadium…
Snarkk, you probably have seen this movie, Lost In America, from the mid 1980s and perhaps, a few others here, have seen it as well. I consider it one of the best comedies EVER. Your post above reminded me of Sabean looking for a leftfielder . . . This clip is over-qualified David seeking a job somewhere in the “middle of nowhere” Arizona.
“I don’t want to hear you say the word ‘nest’ or ‘egg’ in a sentence ever again!”
Yeah Chuck, that scene was classic too.
My favorite part of the movie is after the wife of the Albert Brooks character loses all their money and they try to convince the casino it is great marketing to give the money back.
Pawlie, that would be my ex-wife . . . umm, as the gambler. She was addicted to the casinos. I had to watch her like a hawk. Ha.
Never saw it, Blade.
Not a big Albert Brooks fan, but I’d be willing to Netflix it.
If, if I can jump into our queue ahead of the Snarkettes and order something other than the next fuckin Downton Abbey DVD.
Hey, Mrs. Snarkk and the Snarkettes may be coming to Colorado in the next two weeks. Where should they go in Estes Park and surrounding? Any ideas? — hit me on my private email…
Yes, Chuck. “See that thing over there? Don’t use the word nest. Ever again.” Classic.
Gee, Steve, I hope your ex-wife really didn’t gamble your money away, but . . . it’s believable and possible, eh? We just had a case here in Auburn, NY (where the electric chair was first used, I’ll have you know), where the head of the teachers’ union, maybe the treasurer, was accused of embezzling $808,000! She committed suicide when the heat got too hot. They think it went to the casino! http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2013/06/auburn_police_conclude_sally_j.html
No, she wasn’t that bad . . . Actually, she was uncannily lucky. I was mostly a people watcher at the casinos and she loved to gamble. Sheesh, this lady above was quite a gambler too, huh?
Sure. Regarding the movie – get it while the wife and snarkettes are in Colorado. The movie is flat out funny and it will cure you of any idealistic thoughts of giving up your cushy attorney job and “finding yourself” while touring the U.S. 😉
Man, there are a lot of baseball pundits out there that picked the Blue Jays vs. the Angels in this year’s ALCS. Epic fail.
Lots of people buried the Dogs a couple months ago . . .
The thing about the Dodgers is, it was just not likely that all those historically good players were all going to stay bad all the time. Conversely, we realistically could not expect that so many Giants would have career years, again, or close to it. I don’t know. I mean, look at the calendar. IT IS STILL JULY. Now gotta run to the NY Times and see that article about Ken Harrelson fighting sabermetrics. On second thought, good night, girls.
Yeah you’re right some here chirp on like a bunch of school girls. Man just suck it up should be mantra for the Giants. Less whining and more production! Kruk is the one who has run out of gas. I wish I could slam some duct tape on that old boy.
Well Nip why doesn’t your dumb ass go take a class that explains supply and demand. I’m not expecting to hear back from you for a few years
I was one of them. My bad.
All you guys that want to deal Lincecum, pls tell me what you think the Giants rotation will look like next year.
There isn’t anything coming up til 2015. So you have Bum Cain and f-ing what?
I think part of next year depends on what happens with Posey. I could see them dumping off Belt and playing him FT at 1b. One more bat (Pence has to stay), and I’d say they are good
But, if Surkamp and someone like him is making 30 starts, like Zito or Vogs, SF has no chance. They will never score enough runs; keep the pitching and you have a much better chance to win more often.
Any frontline SP you pick up will cost mega bucks, at least as much as Lincecum. I don’t think it is going to be near as easy to just go pick up one as you think–too much competition from other big bucks teams. And Sabes seems to do best (at least for a while) with scrapheap guys like vogs and the groper.
WillieD I agree with you to a point. My belief is Lincecum will not come back, there will be competition for his arm, competition that will pay more $ and years than Baer is willing to pay, despite this franchise being a money machine. So, under that assumption, trade him now while you can get something(s) you can bargain for, instead of settling for a compensatory pick, that to me, has very little present value. Bring back Gaudin and maybe Vogelsong, depending on how Voggy does the last six weeks coming up. Pick up a FA pitcher to finish the rotation, since you’re going to pay Zits to ride off into the Zenset. It’s not the greatest scenario, but I like it better than a compensatory pick situation that has no near-term value…
Nice word “scrapheap.” I like it.
Fuck you. Say something even remotely interesting or stop posting here. I’m tired or your dumb ass
Flappers should stay out of the GM position. Most would just wet their pants.
One more dumb ass Nipper post in the next 5 min and you are gone. Do it, please
Hey, I’m starting to dig this “what if” trading bullshit. It’s better than watching/listening to/posting about the last month of these death spiral games. IMO…
One thing sabes has had trouble with in the past is finding adequate replacements for who he deals off. That’s how SF wound up with Jose Castillo at 3b, and Tejada/O Cab/Font at SS. If you dump off pence or Sandoval (and Lincecum is in same categoy imo), who plays those spots for 162? Arias and Abreu? Peguero and the kids? They already don’t have enough hitters or SPs…dumping off some of the better of what you have for down the road prospects, I dunno.
I doubt Texas gives up Profar. And no, m Dominguez and his .228 avg (to go with .260 OB) in a hitters yard like Houston isn’t the answer either. He’s hitting 8th for the Astros…nuff said.
Thanks. I’d totally forgotten Castillo, but your reminder brings back bad memories… 😉
Gnight dudes. Another Dowton Abbey DVD is getting cued up. The Makers glass is set for a two finger pour to get through it. With that fortification, to get through it I’ll still have to secretly think of how I’d “ruin”, as BF says, one of these Downton Abbey “ladyship” chicks in the “library” on a languid Sunday afternoon while everyone else was out on the estate having tea and crumpets. Tally Ho!…
Release the hounds!
Is that the same as “Tally THAT Ho?”
When we see suffering, we can use it as an opportunity to service God by helping others.
That must mean there are at least 40,000 more people around the San Francisco Bay Area offering to help others. If the Affordable Care Act has coverage for sufferers who have seen the collapse of a loved one perhaps Flappers should be first in line for compensation. Until then Makers Mark, a sex therapist or an extended holiday somewhere with no sports news will have to do. first to worse, it is a curse, I have a thirst, heal me.
In old money the biggest difference is runs. We are hitting, striking out and grounding into double plays about the same as last year. ERA is off, but not a dramatically as not scoring runs. Hitting must have started out really strong considering the funk this team has been in. And timing, when the team’s mojo is on the errors don’t hurt as much and the hits come when needed. It doesn’t seem that is happening this year.
I have always been suspect about the performance of the medical decision makers. the next few days doesn’t hold much hope for the team management to shine. I hope I am proved wrong.
This is Adrian Beltre and Elvis Andrus being “best friends.”
Then this play not being a laughing matter . . .
http://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/large/794835988.gif?1375038838
Where’s my good buddy, Flavor?
The more I think about the situation, the more I am in-line with Willie’s 8:39 PM post. The Giants have explicitly stated that the intent is to make qualifying offers to Pence and Tim).
And I believe the intent here is to try to work a multi-year deal for each (compensatory picks not being the driver). With only Cain and Bum locked-up for next year, I think you make a play for Tim. If we lose him, oh well…but I think it wiser to make that attempt than to deal him.
If you deal him, you are NOT getting someone who can take his place next year, or probably not an OFer who can come in next year and make an impact.
…so I just got back from my Norcal roadie/camping trip. I haven’t had a chance to follow the Giants real closely.
How have things been going for our beloved Orange and Black??
You should have stayed out camping longer…