Are We Who We Thought We Are?
Last night, we were reminded of who we actually are when we don’t get to play the Marlins. A tired Boston team that should have been suffering at least a bit of a mental letdown after their gagged, emotional loss the night before, came cross-country into AT&T and embarrassed the former World Series champions. I couldn’t bring myself to write “reigning” or “current” after that pathetic, uninspired, weak, impotent excuse for a “performance”.
In the pre-game notes at the Merc (does anyone even read the Chronicle anymore?) the headline is “Bochy Finds No Inspiration in Spoiler Role”. That’s fine, I don’t have a problem with that. And his reasoning: “your job is to come out here and win every game whether you’re in first place or last place.” Again, no problem with that approach to playing the game. But the kicker is that your players have to adopt that sentiment, too. Or at least come up with their own genuine reason to put forth a professional approach to the game. And last night it was clear, this team is missing something massive in it’s approach to the game—whether it’s mental or cognitive or whatever you want to call it. There is NO EXCUSE to catch a Red Sox team in the state they were in last night and get completely run over in every aspect of the game.
Now, if you want to argue that the ‘Sox simply have better players than we do, that’s an argument that has some merit. But I have a hard time believing that the former World Series champions, only a year removed from their title, are so totally and completely worse across the board, from a talent standpoint, than the 2013 Boston Red Sox.
Motivation. Pride. Focus. Effort. Or lack thereof.
That’s the sad reality of what this season has become. And everyone, from Bochy to the coaches to the players deserve the blame for getting bitch-slapped by a Red Sox team that was primed to lose last night……
You have to find a reason, other than a paycheck, to play the game at this level.
A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball 
Your lightening video was better than the game.
Personally, I think you’re over-analyzing things. We lost a game to a team that probably has better players than we do. Not a huge surprise in my book. Call me naive, but I think MLB players try their best to win every game. When they win a few in a row the team appears to have “great chemistry” and “focus” and “energy.” When they hit a losing streak, the team appears “flat” “unmotivated,” “disinterested–playing out the string yada yada yada.”
The Redsox’s do have the #1offense in baseball and were basically the worse (are offense stinks)So no major suprise to me.They have a bunch of guys with 50 or more RBI’s for the year that we don’t come close too.
Kat – I know it seems like our boys are the worst right now, but if you look both over all of MLB or just NL, the O stats are not “awful.”
All of MLB: BA – 10th, OBP 15th, but in R and RBI – 26th.
NL: BA – 4th, OBP – 7th, R – 12th, Avg w/RISP – 6th.
So, they are at worst, middle of the road stat-wise. Their numbers w/RISP are weak, and we all know that. But if this team was getting the pitching it had in 2010 or 2012, I think things would be a bit different.
Anyway, I’ve chalked this one up…let’s see the kids play to see if any of them have potential to fill some holes down the road.
And if the “trend” plays out, who knows what happens next year: 2010 WS, 2011 off year, 2012 WS, 2013 off year…2014 ???
I didn’t see the game…had agility class with my dog (that was probably a blessing).
I think it is probably a bit of both your and SanDawg’s take. I think position-by-position the Sox probably have better players, but are they that much better? I don’t think so.
And that is where I agree with you Craig. I have been saying for quite a while that “that spark” they had when they were winning seems to be gone. And I know I’ll get some heat and stats thrown into my face my Twin and maybe a few others, but I still think that Pagan’s loss had a big effect on the team. And I am not saying his loss is the main reason they went into this prolonged funk…there are a multitude of reasons (guys having off years, injuries, etc.), but I think Crazy Horse brought some fire to the clubhouse that seems to be missing now.
Regardless of the reasons, I believe that on a regular basis they should make a better showing than what they did last night.
Pagan’s absence can’t be measured quantitatively. In my mind too, the Giants went from a team where “walk off homers” (or hits) were the norm and we expected to win every game. The music died when Pagan got injured.
I’m with you guys on that. It can’t just be a coincidence that the season went down the toilet after Pagan went out. It could probably be argued that the team should have found a way to carry on, but part of that’s on Sabean for not going out and getting someone other than a Dumpster-dive French-fry. And Sabean sort of endorsed the idea that it’s just not the Giants season this year, with his “bad penny season” comment, which sort of sounded like throwing in the towel.
But certainly, so many players have under-achieved this season that it’s not all on Sabean or Bochy. Some kind of drive is missing from the team this season, as BF posted about.
I think it comes down to Sox are still playing for something…giants have been toast since the Cubs embarrassed them. Clearly they aren’t 100% focused energized motivated.
And I believe every team is still a little more fired up to stomp on the defending champs.
Oh sure…it’s the old “kick ’em while they’re down” mentality. The Giants would do the same if the roles were swapped (especially if it were the Bums who were the defending champs)…
toast since … since… I don’t know…Mets swept us? A’s beat us? how far back must we go?
“Post of the Day!
snarkk said, on August 19, 2013 at 10:32 pm (Edit) At this rate, we may all meet with Ted somewhere outside ATT before the Flapalooza, and never go into the game…”
Does this mean we are going to a play? 😉
Ha!
A few months ago I was actually wondering how much chatting with the other Flappers in the Club level would interfere with watching the game. That’s laughable now. Not being as focused on the game that night is not a concern.
Right now, Giants games are like plays — exruciating, with bad endings. Eugene O’Neil as manager…
Speaking of laughable- how about the Ball-gal that battled Arias for that foul pop-up. Are you kidding me?? You literally can’t believe what you’re seeing on a daily basis these days.
You know the season’s gone when the balldudettes are calling off your players on foul pops… 😉
Well, consider this. Except for LF and CF, this same starting squad of 8 position players is likely to take the field again next opening day, assuming they re-sign Pence. Pagan hopefully will be starting in one of those two open OF spots, so the only difference in starters next season will be one spot. One. So, the fall off the cliff this season better be the result of some kind of nasty intangible, not player talent. Because the talent ain’t gonna change much, other than getting a year older. If the nasty intangible is the cause, that’s a mental thing, motivational, some kind of post-WS win manopause. That’s an unfortunate conclusion, since it doesn’t say much for the character of the team and coaches, after a wondrous 2012…
Well, there will be changes in the pitching staff, too. With only two starters locked-up, Zito gone, and Tim and Vogey question marks (I think there is a good chance they pick-up Vogey’s 6 mil option), there will be some changes in the starting staff.
And I see some changes in the bullpen. Not sure Mijares will be back (he is arbitration eligible) or Machi, etc.
I agree with your post, word for word, and most of what is said above. It is inexcusable. The ESPN announcers were kind. They said it was the Giants, not the Red Sox, who looked tired on every level: physically, spiritually, emotionally, metaphysically, existentially. To me, the highlight was off the field: the ESPN guys praising Bochy’s handling of the bullpen in the 2012 postseason and Bochy’s approaching HOF status. But all that is a reference to the past, not now. As much as I love what Bochy and the coaches have done, I can’t deny it: you all look listless, flat, uninspired, uninterested, beaten. you, being the team on the field and in the dugout. And that’s on Bochy. That is not acceptable. Period. Show some fuckin pride. I turned it off at 5-0 and took later peaks online that made me wince. I still do not know the final score. Or care. What a fuckin waste of time.
Well, it is part of Bochy and crew’s responsibility to get the team ready to play and to get the max potential out of them. But the players own a lot of that, too. They have the potential to go out there and give 100% on any/every day, and they can do that with or without the coddling of the coaching staff.
I read yesterday, maybe on a Baggs column, where if the Giants finish last, they’ll be only the 3rd team in modern baseball history (100 years, I dunno, not goin’ to go back to check) to go from first to worst. So, it’s worse than I thought. This almost NEVER happens. So, they can’t do that. They need to get out of the cellar and finish at least 4th. Otherwise, ultra embarrassing, and fuels the fires of the 2012 “luck” allegers, whose positions are supported by the increasing numbers of losses like last night’s abomination…
It just goes to show how little the difference between good and bad is, I suppose. This same group of guys thoroughly dominated the shit out of the supposedly big bad Tigers falls meekly to the Cubbies?
Even early in the year they were winning close games, coming back from 5 run deficits and generally playing fairly well. You figured they’d tighten things up and start rolling. At some point shit just stopped working.
Playoff hangover? WBC hangover? Bullshit. Detroit is doing just fine. Most of the other playoff teams (Cincy, Atl, Nats, Det, Oak) are back in the hunt. Most other teams lost players to the WBC as well. The Giants look flat, dull, and uninterested. While Bochy’s style works while winning, you have to wonder who has checked out this season. There have been a ton of mental errors out there this year. A lot more than the previous 3 years combined. How many 8 pitch innings did the Giants batters put together last night?
I don’t know. I’m surprised there isn’t fan backlash at the park. The effort may be there, but the results are far from there. It sure looks like these guys are playing out the string.
Totally agree. That’s why it’s ultra embarrassing. None of the other last year’s playoff teams cratered. Why should we be the only one, as Kruk says, that’s “run out of gas”. Maybe he means run out of motivaton, but won’t say it, because of the bad vibes that generates. I think they just put the order for Bochy’s HOF bust on hold…
Bochy takes some blame for the train wreck. Sorta…
http://www.csnbayarea.com/giants/exclusive-bochys-self-evaluation-i-could-have-handled-it-better
Ahhh. Sad news. Just saw Elmore Leonard passed away this morning. His writing was always fun trashy crazy shit. If you like that kind of stuff.
Frankly, the ‘luck’ crowd can go fuck themselves. Winning one can be considered lucky. Does anyone call the Phils and their lone WS win luck? Winning 2 in 3, you’ve done something right.
Doesn’t change the future, it just reinforces how hard it is to keep a team competitive enough to win it all twice.
I agree. Nobody is lucky that wins a major sports title. You have to go through too many teams, too many hoops. The “luck” crowd has to be mainly the ECoasters brainwashed by ESPN that figure any team that wins other than the Yanks or RSox or Phils or Tigers or Cards has a suspect championship. Baloney…
The 2010-2012 Giants’ place in baseball history is secure. Their achievement will only continue to grow in status in the future. We’re still too close to it to fully appreciate what happened. The 2013 season will fade into trivia. For Giants fans, it would have been nice to be able to bask more this season. But apparently the players were doing the basking this season. Once this trainwreck of a season is over, Giants fans will perk up and eagerly look forward to 2014. As some have said: “Every other year, like clockwork!”
Good point, zumiee. P-e-r-s-p-e-c-t-i-v-e. But it is still a bitterly disappointing season. Today.
As for Bochy and the Hall Of Fame, he’s well on track. He just needs a few hundred more wins to lock it up, so I’ll call that about three or four more seasons’ worth. I would assume those seasons will be with the Giants, although stranger things have happened.
Posey is on track for the Hall Of Fame, as long as he stays a catcher for at least five more seasons or so. Switching to another position too soon will greatly dilute his chances.
Who was the last (mostly) Giant to make the Hall Of Fame, and who would the next one be? Does Kent have a chance? I can’t think of the last Giants Hall Of Famer. And it ain’t ever going to happen for Barry, I don’t think, as long as the sportswriters get to be the “moral conscience” of the sport. Yeah, a bunch of guys like Ray Ratto being the moral conscience of the sport.
McCovey?
I think the Baby Bull was the last inducted.
Yeah, it’d be cool to have Bonds and Kent go in together — and then have each try to choke the other at the podium. Hey, did you know the Giants have the most HOFers? And the franchise has more wins than any other. Really.
I disagree on Bonds…I think he will eventually get in. And I think Kent will get in, too (he broke a number of records for second basemen that had been held by Rogers Hornsby).
A Flapper raised the interesting point about who will be the first manager to challenge the “neighborhood” play at second base next season. There was a play last night where someone (Pedroia?) was off the bag already before he received the throw. That’s a real big issue for next season.
Whoever pays the first game next year.
Zumie, after fighting for years to get above .500, Bochy made it this season, but has slipped below the .500 mark.
He’s 1509-11513. f anything, this should be the Giants battle cry. Get Coach over .500!
I just read the Baggarly column on his interview with Bochy. The thing that surprised me was that from the sound of it Bochy was not as even-keeled as is typical, that he seemed to light into guys, in the dugout. He says he regrets that. Interesting. I thought it was just the opposite. Hmmm. (Didn’t the skipper visibly turn from Belt as he came into the dugout after a base-running blunder? Any other incidents?)
I remember an incident with a pitcher earlier in the season. One of the starting pitchers happened to be mouthing off to no one in particular after getting taken out (I think it was Zito, but I could be wrong), and Bochy walked over and got pretty close to his face and said something, and that ended that.
Yeah, after the Belt baserunning error, that was the most angrily I’ve ever seen Bochy react to one of his own players.
Chad Gaudin on the 15-day disabled list with carpal tunnel syndrome, Giants designate outfielder Jeff Francoeur for assignment. Mike Kickham and Jean Machi recalled to replace Gaudin and Francoeur.
The Toeur de Francoeur has been cancelled? Sonofabitch.
He should’ve been gone after Stage 1.
French Fry gets his walking papers
5 teams in 5 years!
Sure there room for a 6th sucker next year!
There were a few times when Drrrrty was pitching that I thought Bochy’s head was going to explode. He apparently hides the fact that he goes after these guys in the clubhouse pretty well.
What is this injury gonna do to Gaudin’s groping hobby? It’s got to cut into it, right?
Can’t . . . pinch . . . . nipples! Aaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrgh!
You gotta think he’d just switch straight to the surprise motor boat, right?
you motorboatin’ son of a bitch, you ol sailor you! One of my all time favorite 1:22 movie clips.
super disappointed that Kickham is called up but that Zito gets the start tomorrow. What is the point of that? Although there are scouts who think Kickham is more suited to relief anyway. I want to see Kick or Surk start another game this year just to prove that my eyes were deceiving me and they weren’t as bad as they seemed. What was it, 4 starts, 10 innings, 24ER’s? That’s totally from memory so feel free to correct if I’m mistaken…….
what could Bochy possibly have meant wheh he told this to Schulman:
Henry Schulman @hankschulman 59m
Two more things: Pagan to Fresno on Friday. And Bochy told Francoeur to consider the #sfgiants in the future.
the first to last stat is a little disingenuous, because until expansion in the 60s there were 8 teams, and now even if they do finish last in the division SF will only be 5th. And their record should be better than at least a few NL teams. I’d be willing to bet a few teams went from first to fifth and the Giants might have done it themselves.
Elmore Leonard was a joy to read, often really funny. His Western stuff was good too.
Another nice offensive effort. Hey, can we play the Marlins every game?
I wish Shane Victorino were [subjunctive mode] on our team. Always plays hard. Excellent fielder. Aw, what a stupid thing to type. He. is. not. on. our. team. and. is. not. going. to. be. ever. #nomoreFrancoeur
Belt left at 3rd after a leadoff triple. The only positive I can take out of this is there must be Yanks fans cursing somewhere.
You don’t see that every day, failing to score in consecutive innings with a runner on third and nobody out — you gotta love this game!
oh f…belt hammers another one and deja vu all over again. (I know, like *au jus* sauce).
new thread, girls [we need a TedSpe sighting to say G’night gentlemen question mark]