Bad Pitching + Bad hitting = Bad Combo
They’ve hit 4 bombs in the last 2 games, that’s nice. But that’s not enough. Way too many “1-4,0-4’s” in the boxscores. And our pitching has come up ant-small so far. Dirrrrty may or may not need to pitch a pearl today–the way he’s been pitching I’d expect a line like 5.1inn/4ER/4BB/7K. Bottom line is, regardless of what Dirrrrty does, we need to HIT the baseball. For hits. Lots of them. Ducks on the pond. Clutch hits. All that jazz….
This has been a horrendous 2 game swing, every facet of the game has been worthy of averting your eyes. But it’s 2 freaking games out of 162. The team isn’t trippin’ on it, you guys shouldn’t either. Join Denny on the ledge if you must, but don’t jump. Yet….
A Place To Talk About Giants Baseball 
Actually, dennis ended the last thread on a positive note.
Opinions vary as to why…but I say why question a good thing
Of course, I didn’t see the game since I was driving all day. maybe I would feel worse about had I been forced to watch it unfold. But it really is just one game. If they had been hitting and pitching like shit ALL YEAR, I’d trip on it. Not after 2 games……
Yeah, don’t jump yet, but you’re more than welcome to start the countdown. As Flav said, we need to HIT the baseball. May I also humbly suggest we try taking a walk. ZERO free passes received yet this series. I know we’re not big on the base on balls, but one or two might help. It’d be nice to have a duck or two on the pond when our guys are hitting bangin’ ’em outta the yard. I think our last walk was Sunday afternoon in the 3rd inning vs the Friars some 24 frames ago by Timothy LeRoy Lincecum. Jesus H. Christ that is pathetic. Stride up to home plate sans bat and see if Hamels can throw 3 strikes before missing wide 4 times or something.
Here’s what I want for tonight: draw 3 walks, three walks, THREE walks, from Philly pitchers that will help us push across 5 or 6 runs ensuring us a having the lead in the 9th so B-Wheezy can finally get back into a game so he can walk three batters of his own. 😀
Well, every team (when will SD, though?) goes through these dogshit stretches, and maybe since I didn’t see any of it as well, it isn’t such a raw wound as it is with others, but to bail now is a bit premature.
But then again, Dennis knows all about that.
Point being, they win this, they’re 1out of the WC. Fricking Madres can’t lose for trying. Even during the Giant’s hot streak, they only gained 2.5 on SD. They passed 4 WC teams though.
That’s right, Chuck. You leave the bailing out to me, and I’ll leave the premature to you.
Did you remember to do your Kegel exercises this morning?
They need one like the 10-0 game they had Aug 3rd, when Sanchez beat Colo.
Since then, they have scored 44 runs in 14 games and given up 72.
Of those 44, 23 were scored against the Cubs.
Tough stretch. Atl, SD, Philly STL and Cinn all in 3 weeks.
That’s my wife’s job, Dennis.
You, on the other hand have to tighten up those sphincter muscles. Yer attracting flies . . .
Excellent point, denny. Walks are critical to run scoring success, unless you are a team that’s going to lead the league in hrs, which we obviously are not. No bbs in two gms is a fucking joke….
giants seem to be a streaky team. They had a bad slide before the all star break and then won a bunch of games right before the end of the first half. Of course we all know how awesome july was and now the giants are in a rough patch. Hopefully they can finish the rest of august the way they played in july…but stl and cin will be tough.
These losses,they all look the same.It’s not just depressing,it’s boring.I’m tired of knowing what to expect.Early slight lead,then the other team ties it.We have a chance,we come up short,other team takes the lead,team makes errors,pitchers make bad pitches,blowout.The least they could do is figure out new ways to lose.I guess all I can say is Go Giants(they’ll have to earn !back).
Good news on the Sept. horizon includes D’Backs (7-2), Brewers (4-0), Cubs (3-1). Streak of July 4 – Aug. 2 feasted on toads: 10-1 vs. Milw., AZ, DC. Dodgers’ flailing moves have done nothing and those tin men are in free fall, so those games are ripe too. Stay near the pack, fend off sweeps until Aug. 27.
In Jed We Trust.
Barry Bonds likely will get off the hook because his trainer refuses to testify; Roger Clemens, it appears, will get gaffed big time because his trainer did testify (and, also, did preserve the bloody evidence). Barry Bonds inspired that kind of loyalty. Amazing, in a way.
Just play the game. The Giants are just not playing well during this stretch. They will come out of it. In the short-term it’s painful.
Kat is right about one thing, the Giants score a couple of runs and then the offense dries up faster than the Mojave dessert in July!! Phillies scored in 4 straight innings, when was the last time the Giants did that?? I still believe the WC is attainable as well as the Division. Like Kuip said this morning “It isn’t suppose to be easy”!
I’m not jumping off the ledge just yet but it’s starting to look like the hot July may have been just an aberration.
Let’s say that after all their maneuvering and, despite having a lot of promising future pieces, the Giants end up 4 games out of the WC. Is Sabean finally in the hot seat or does he continue to get a pass? Is Bochy in the hot seat? I’ve been on the fence with both guys for a while and I’m not necessarily advocating their firing. But I think that Giants ownership should take a good long look at what they’re getting for their money this offseason, even if they make the playoffs.
Yep…It’s Bochy and Sabean at fault for Lincecum and Sandoval under achieving….
As I’ve said before, amazing they’re in it.
Well, signing Benji in the off season, getting less than hoped for from him through June and then replacing him with a rookie who has to run out to the mound 10 times per game to get the signs right — those weren’t Sabean’s and Bochy’s finest moments, either. Damn fuckers fail to predict the future nearly 50% of the time. Book it.
Like I said, I’m not advocating that either of them should be fired. There are enough questions about their performance raised by the doomer crowd and not all of them are invalid. It’s not that earth-shattering to think that ownership will look long and hard at Sabean and Bochy.
not that it matters much but the phillies are 25-5 in their last 30 games….they are RED hot
Do you guys read the stuff Henry S. posts over on the Splash now? From last night’s communique:
“Skies are threatening as I write this. The Giants absolutely need to win tonight.”
Jeez. Post the suicide hotline number for him (maybe over on his comedy blog). (Maybe he’s about to lose his job? I got a flyere the other day offering me the hardcopy Chronical for $19.99 per year.)
Anyway, Henry’s not the only one susceptible to the doom and gloom virus. I don’t know how many times this season we’ve seen Kruk and Kuip show up on the pre-game show looking, behind all the professional bs, devastated by the Giants skids, by the team’s inability (so far) to put this baby away. Well, looks like it’s not going to be easy. I don’t see this team giving up, however.
Interesting post oozed out of the cellar of Room B yesterday,to the effect that posts about tipping pitches, pitching performances, managerial decisions, etc. were irrelevant because the team wasn’t hitting well during this 5-9 spell. To quote:
“5-9 in this slump, another 2-run effort added to the data. But, yeah, let’s ignore the obvious and hen peck at tipping pitches, errors, bullpen, Bochy.” Einstein accidentally nailed one: a losing streak or bad stretch of ball is fueled by ALL of those things. What kind of idiocy lives amongst us that can suggest that defense, pitching, and fundamentals are incidentals?
Children, settle down. “Giants are streaky”: so is everybody, nimrod. And other teams also feast on poor teams to “pad” their stats. Of COURSE the Giants hit better againnst worse competition. DUH. The Splash is a stupider group than this one, but as I said of Dennis: this is the nelliest fucking bunch. You people panic like sissies with a mouse in the room. A few wins and you’ll all be planning for October baseball again Then a couple losses and you’ll be doing swan dives off the Tranny Tower. Talk about BOR-ING…
I’m not panicking at all but I have been concerned by the pattern that the Giants have followed to this good record: terrific play against the bad teams and consistently bad play against the good teams. Go look at the team-vs.-team grid on ESPN.com and tell me that the Giants’ record vs. good teams isn’t a huge red flag.
Twin, you know my writing on the Splash and that I will argue against doomers who think every stat proves the Giants are going to fail. I’m not getting hysterical here, just pointing out a concern.
As I posted last night, undoubtedly lost in the idiocy around us: Twins were 7 out three weeks ago, they now have a 5 game lead. 5 and 6 game leads disappear ALL THE TIME.
Nervous Nellie? When I see a lineup such as today’s, you bet’cha…
CF Rowand
2B F. Sanchez
1B Posey
LF Burrell
RF Guillen
SS Uribe
3B Sandoval
C Whiteside
P J. Sanchez
What in the wide, wide, world of sports is Bochy thinking batting Rowand lead off again?
No need to watch his first AB, first pitch: 5-3 three hopper putout. Book it!
Well, Jediot called Rowand. Funny. Other than that, it’s what I thought it would be:
“Most likely LU tomorrow, with record against Hamels (NOT “Hammels”:
Torres CF ( 1-3 2 RBI )
Sanchez 2B ( 3-9 2 RBI)
Posey 1B N/A
Burrell LF N/A
Guillen RF ( 2-3 2 double, 2 RBI)
Uribe SS ( 0-6)
Sandoval 3B ( 2-7 1 double)
Whiteside C ( 0-4)
Dave McKay is rolling in his grave thinking the same thing Dennis.I’ll give Rowand 3 pitches though, one take fastball,and 2 sliders in the dirt oughta do it.
Boys, who ELSE to lead off if Torres sits? Answer: no one. Move on..
That’s very true, if you don’t play torres there’s no one else to leadoff.
I could’ve posted that LU last nite…said so on giants website…Mike told you guys AH needed a day…
And Rowan had to have a courtesy start in Philly against the LH…
Chances are good Giants get clobbered again tonight. If Sanchez survives 6 full against this hot Phils lineup, it’ll be a shock. Maybe Rohand will remember how to hit a home run in his old yard. He should be good for a 1-4, thinking on the positive side — with a coupla grounders to the left side and a K whiffing on an outside slider thrown in for good measure….
Great the Cubs battled back to to take a 2-1 lead on the Pads.Only to see Marshall come in and give up 4hits and then a major brain freeze by the Cubs.They get Headley in a rundown the plate,force him back to 3rd,tag him out as another runner is standing on 3rd.The runner notices the catcher is nonchalantly gonna throw the ball back to the pitcher who’s no where near home plate so the guy takes off and beats him to the plate.Brill ant 5-2 Book it game over.
Snarkk, agreed, but none of these LUs are generating enough offense. This one will probably do about the same as the other 2: not enough….
Look at the up the middle comparison. Rollins + Utley + Victorino vs. Uribe + Sanchez + Rohand. Ouch…
“Last time a Giants starter won a game, Jonathan Sanchez was on the mound. That was 16 days ago.”
rowand, sanchez, sandoval, whiteside….can we get an over under on the number of hits they will combine for? How about double play balls or strike outs?
Ya never know, El Presidente might just jerk one out of this popstand….
No particular problem with Rowand other than the fact that Torres from EITHER side has often generated the only run or two in a low scoring affair. The problem is more that, again, Torres is the only guy on the squad with the ability to generate a run from a walk or single. But they can hardly sit Burrell or Guillen right now.. The cliche is true: it is what it is. Needs to be addressed in the off season. With that said, this offense can rock Hamels, he’s given up 22 HR and Rowand plus the 3 thru 7 holes can all take him deep. Only outing here was last year for Sanchez, Dirty went 6, K’ed 8, gave up one. Lost 1-0. They’ll win today, 6-3.
Yes, Eli can do it, as well. Esopecially if it’s early and Hamels nods off.
“And Rowan had to have a courtesy start in Philly against the LH…”
WTF does that mean? Let’s sit our MVP so fucking Rowand can take a goddamn bow?
Rowand vs Hamels: 3 for 12 (3b) 1 RBI 3 Ks ZERO walks
Torres vs Hamels: 1-3 (2B) 2 RBI 1 K 1 walk
Unless Andres is on his way to the morgue, no way in hell should Rowand be starting.
Bochy is a goddamn boob for playing Rowand today. I don’t care what his reason is, it’s wrong.
This team hasn’t drawn a walk since the last time Chuck’s wife gave him a courtesy fuck and Bochy’s hair brained idea to put an end to this shit is to start Rowand and bat him lead off? Stoopid beyond belief.
Ya Dennis, I hear ya…Didn’t say it was right, just that it figured.
Dennis, why even analyze Rohand’s past stats against anybody? Waste of time. The guy sucks against whomever he faces, that’s why Bochy only gives him a “courtesy” start every now and again — and saves some face for Sabean as to why this guy is still on the squad. After the rosters expand, he’ll be lucky to find an open seat at the end of the dugout pine…
But Torres was in those lineups not collecting a walk as well. And, it should be noted, not bunting to test the foot speed of those athletic looking Philly pitchers. He can’t bunt, he won’t bunt, so while he’s the best leadoff hitter the Giants have … against righties, they flat out don’t have one.
Actually, Rowand has been a more than competent 4/5 OFer since they started spotting him. He only has 57 AB since the break, hitting .281 BA .366 OBP .759 OPS. Just fine for a spot starter.
Great value for $12 million…
It’s official, Clemens just indicted for perjury before Congress on the steroid deal. He’s in deeper doo doo than Bonds, as Xooty mentioned above, this time HIS trainer is spilling the beans. Bonds was smart enough to take care of that “loyallty” a long time ago, cost unknown. Greg Anderson will probably end up a lifetime “consultant” to Barry. Rocket, couldn’t have happened to a nicer guy…
Weird, my post vanished. Something about picking a good game to miss entirely yesterday. And noting that Snatchez was the last starter to win a game. On Aug 3 . . .
Strange, i had a dream last night. Giant win 6-2.
It ain’t Martin Luther King, but I’ll take it.
Perjury is chickenshit stuff. It’s one thing to indict and another to convict.
It’s one thing to go into a grand jury proceeding on your own, no defense lawyers allowed, and try to deal with the prosecutors’ various attacks and ambushes. It’s another thing to go on tv with your lawyer sitting by your side and say, in response to stiff, unsurprising questions: “Andy must’ve misheard,” or “I misremembered,” or “the HGH was for my wife, who . . .” On the basis of stupidity alone, Clemens deserves to take a fall.
His contract is not an issue now, Snarkkles. It’s getting what they can from him. I’ll look for your next sideline reports on Bobblehead days, Cathy.
Rowand is currently worth 3.9 million, Torres 21.9 million. The centerfield position is a bargain.
All that other bullshit about Rowand being a competent 4/5 OFer aside, why can’t you just admit that Bochy starting him tonight in lieu of Torres is one giant and colossal mistake?
Batting AND fielding, here are the top 10 in MLB, and what they are worth in millions based on this year’s performance. Huff is 14th at 17.5:
Hamilton 26.6
Zimmerman 24.1
Beltre 22.8
Crawford 22.4
Cano 22.2
Votto 21.9
Torres 21.9
Longoria 21.8
Miggy Cabrera 21.4
Pujols 21.0
hey don’t forget rowand is good against knuckle ball pitchers!!! oh, wait wrong series. sorry.
I didn’t see the game last night (my kid called me a couple of time with updates; he was pretty exasperated). So I didn’t hear Krukow call out Buster on his “fundamentals.” Apparently, Krukow objected to Posey’s “bush league” attempt to fool Utley with a fake shake-off. Also, at some point, Posey slapped the dirt when he wanted a pitch down. Bruce Jenkins, rather ghoulishly embellishing Krukow’s smack down, has generated more discussion on his blog today than I’ve seen in a long time. (Nipper’s over there giving them wtf.)
Nobody seems to know that Krukow was a catcher originally and converted to pitcher. I think Krukow’s overreactiing, but I didn’t see the fake-shake or obvious dirt slap. I am very disappointed, however, to learn that Posey’s fundamentals may not be near perfect.
Kruk always will rip on a rookie, and look the other way when a vet screws up. I guess now that Posey’s BA is down to around .340 from above .350, his fundamentals are an issue. When he was pounding the opposition in that big, successful roadie back to DC, etc in July and became the NL player of the month, I guess his fundamentals were better then…
The Posey fundamentals discussion is making me nostalgic for the analyses of Fred’s crummy fine motor skills and lousy routes to the ball, all the stuff that destroyed the Giants’ pennant hopes last year.
Pat the Bat has kicked and fumbled the ball at least a dozen times out there in left, and we currently have the slowest RFer in ML history. But this year it will be Posey’s receiving skills that do us in.
Sorry. It was Ibanez Posey tried to fool with the fake shake off. Utley scored on the hit.
DennyWad: since the best results have come when you sissybitched the most, I’ll admit nothing, Nelly. They are 10-5 in Rowand’s last 15 starts.
With Torres having periodic issues with his hammy, a LHer going, Rowand’s success in Philly, I’ll allow this one even if it does allow Jediot some traction here. Ideally, Burrell or Gullien would sit to get Aaron a start but not based on recent performance. Those two have to be in there…
I don’t believe in the voodoo economics of actual performance converted to “what if” contracts. If you want to average the voodoo value of the Giants OF, go ahead. The fact is the Giants have several huge sunk costs in some bad contracts, including Rohand’s, which is the most glaring of position players. Arguing that he’s OK value now since Torres is undervalued is saying that with one foot on fire and the other on ice, on average the feet are fine. Bochy is doing what he should do, and that’s play Rohand as little as possible, because they won’t DFA him and can’t trade him now. Barring injury to another OFer, he should pretty much disappear under roster expansion, and then will be traded in the off season for a song. As for sideline reporting, luckily I don’t know WTF you’re tallking about, other than it must have a twisted or vulgar connotation…
i agree completely…rowand is NOT worth the cost of his contract.
Guys need some rest, incl. Torres. He’ll get his PH. Pablo has been JT-like all year vs. LHP, but I was unaware that Huff has 5 Ks in 7 career ABs vs. Hammels. Good night for Huff to take break.
The main point was the original one, asshole. He’s on the roster, Bochy is getting use out of him( exactly as I said it would go down after Burrell was signed.) His contract is irrelevant now.
Listen, you are the dumb fuck who dissed Sabean because Burrell has OVER performed. Get the fuck out, Cathy. Let’s hear about the pretty dresses in the stands.
WTF are you talking about? I never dissed Sabean because Burrell overperforms. I’m surprised like most at how Burrell has performed, but I never complained about it just because Sabean got him. You’re mixing me up with someone else…
It’s “Hamels”.
Then his inbred family doesn’t know how to spell/pronounce it.
It’s also “Guillen”.
Bitching about salaries is a moot point. The (literally) bottom line on all salaries of all players is based on past performance, not projected. It’s just the way it is. Yes you could call it “voodoo” economics but it’s sort of looked at as if the player has *already* earned what they’re being paid today. In Rowand’s case, for example, the Giants just happened to sign him after an All Star/Gold Glove year. You can argue against the system and you may have valid points but it has always been this way.
Which is also why Torres is such a steal
Absolutely. Huff too. And the $52M spent on Zito, Rowand, Freddy, DeRosa, Renteria . . . exceeds the entire Padre payroll.
ironically in football it is the complete opposite. HUGE 50 million dollar contracts are given to college kids whose past performance is jack shit. Re: Alex Smith
So, all this bitching about Posey’s “fundamentals” is then, too. He’s here, he’s catching, and doing a good job. And hitting around .340, too…
Once is a typo, every time is a moron.
Is that why the Mariners cut Rich Aurilia’s salary in half and the Reds paid him $600K and $1.3M on one-year deals, and then Sabean came back and gave Aurilia two-years and $8M?
Yes. It was based on his past perfromance with the *Giants*. He’d already earned it for the *Giants*
I didn’t say it was simple
Richie got the Sabes “good Giant” premium…
Smith sucked before he got his contract? That’s the dumbest fucking statement of the day and there was a lot of competition from Denny and Snarkk.
you really think he is worth 50 million? ok, he played for UTAH in the MOUNTAIN WEST and won a BCS bowl….urban meyer even said he was useless until he learns a system and 5 NFL seasons show that you cock sucker
He got what number one guys get. Talk foortball on the football blog, goober. Or suck some more of soph’s bony protruberances.
http://www.ninersnation.com/2008/7/19/574773/urban-meyer-on-49ers-qb-al
And why the fuck are you here? Your asinine courtship of Soph drove what was left of the knowlegeable baseball fans away from the Splash. Go back. Soph and Barry are your mates, pal.
you got some serious issues
I guess Jediot is talking to Ted. But Aurilia’s contract is not relevant to anything at all right now. Torres’ is. Uribe. Burrell. Huff. It’s TOTALLY fucking valid to look at the roster as a whole in evaluating Sabean’s performance. Ity’s utter rot to even suggest that “bargain” players giving elite performance shouldn’t be included in the evaluation. Really, get OUT..
Ted: Snarkk and Jed are still on Dante Powell. Give ’em some time.
SJ is trying to fuck a tranny on a blog and *I’ve* got issues?
look, i was just commenting on how in football the contracts to rookies are based on speculation of what the person can do in the NFL and not on past performance like in MLB. It was just a comment, I’m sorry you got all upset about it. You seemed like a decent guy on the splash and even though we got into it a couple times it was no big deal. The soph thing was a complete joke because EVERYONE knows soph is some dude who is REALLY bad at making up a persona. I’m sorry you are so offended by me. Good luck man. Enjoy the game etc.
Don’t worry SJ. Everybody offends Oracle, except maybe his dog, and I’m not sure about that…
Ah, there’s nothing more riveting than reading about Rowand’s contract
I switched to a lavender soap, how’s that grab ya?
Check Buster’s bat, it must be corked. No way that ball should have traveled that far on a swing like that.
Either that or Andres lent him some pills.
Yeah, any team, any time. Twins were 7 out 3 weeks ago? Great. The 51 Giants, blah blah blah.
Just get a fucking win TONIGHT.
Now, the shut-down inning hasn’t been J. Sanchez’s specialty this season, but maybe just maybe….
2-0 lead early in the game…lets’s hold this and win
Helluva start; three runs tallied; two more aboard and only one out. Who made the out again?
Sandoval’s killed the Giants much like Bay’s killed the Mets. Where would SF be if Panda was around 20/75/.310?
phillies announcers just ragged on sandoval for his 21st double play…but we still put up 3 runs… Maybe I should pay the extr $5 to get the giants announcers on mlbtv.com
21 Dps? That fat fucker better not hit into #22 tonight or I’ll have another conniption fit.
Jesus H. How many Dps is that for the Panda? He and Rowand accounted for all three outs.
I’m gonna continue to rag on ’em all night since it’s producing runs, so get used to it.
Pretty typical that a 3 run inning would produce two negative comments..
We like the lead. It should have been more, if Panda stops swingin at crap….
Nice swinging K by Rohand, as predicted. The other guys got it goin, wow, that helps. So a good 3 run lead should settle Sanchez, hopefully. Freakin Panda, just throw shit near the dirt or in his eyes, and he’s swingin. I’m sorry, I luv the guy’s attitude, but he’s got a fearful dose of the sophomore slump….
Uh, four…
Actually, if you knew baseball at all, Denny, you’d know that Rowand’s was still a good AB. Let the other hitters see Hamels’ stuff…
Rohand, the designated strike out to show everybody else what the pitcher’s got. I love it…
WTF you talkin’ ’bout, it produced 3 runs. It was a great AB.
SJ, then wy did Posey get $6 mill before he swung a bat?
Or the Nats just shelling $25 mill for 2 guys who hadn’t played a lick?
there are always exceptions, but posey was a first round pick….look at the salaries of first round picks in the NFL and they are usually larger by one order of magnitude
Guaranteed there’s a rookie cap after this season, if there’s any football at all . . .
BTW, Dirty, according to K and K, was right at league average for shut down innings. I think it was 75 percent.
Great job, Dirty. That’s just what the doctor ordered, a blank frame. I’m praising Jonathan tonight, everybody else (especially Rowand and Panda) are getting new assholes tonight.